Dealing with children in public

This is in response to Christine Zielinski's letter printed June 26.
I am not of her generation, but I had five children in seven years. We took them everywhere and strangers would comment to us about how well-behaved they were. It made the children, and us, very proud.
Our children did not have tantrums in public. They knew our expectations, and lived up to them. Behavior in public was a nonissue.
Now, I see parents bargaining for good behavior and issuing empty threats. Or, worse yet, ignoring their children's bad behavior.
Those parents should do themselves, their children and the general public a favor and explain to their children beforehand what is expected of them and remove the children immediately if they start testing. No second chances. Take them home. No explanation necessary, and continue that routine until the children stop testing. It won't take long.
Children are smart and they want to know the rules. They need parents to be consistent.
Kudos to the Flints (letter, June 19). They are dead-on.
Diana K. Pratt, Rumford

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Displaying comments, from newest to oldest

helga's picture

joe, mom as you call her has

joe, mom as you call her has not posted on this issue since yesterday so don't twist your arm patting yourself on the back.

verified

Wow that shut up mom and I

Wow that shut up mom and I do not feel the least bit guilty.

Joe Ziehm
Lewiston ME
Live the life that you want to, do not believe those who fool you, and always question. Conservatives want all three lines deleted and replaced with Communist rhetoric.

momof4's picture

Joe the Preacher: How many

Joe the Preacher: How many kids do you have? My kids are well-behaved in public yet their spirit isn't broken. They know that going out to dinner is a privilege and there is certainly NOTHING WRONG with setting guidelines and expectations, which, if not met, results in loss of the privilege at the least. My kids have learned respect through setting these expectations and following through. Psychobabble is not effective. Boundaries are. There is no substitute for experience regarding parenting. I do work in the school system, and I have witnessed many many behavioral issues. Then you meet the parents and it all becomes clear. The vast majority of these issues are due to lax, uneven, ineffective parenting. The child has no boundaries, role models or consequences for his actions. What a shame, as you know that child will be a parent some day, with most probably the same attitude toward discipline. You are doing your child a huge disservice if you don't teach them these things at a young age. It is your responsibliity as a parent....

verified

I commented on nonverbal

I commented on nonverbal autism and other disorders and disabilities you completely ignored that issue. What that makes you seem is as though you were reaching for a burst of energy. Psychologically that reach has no support you tried to down play learning disabilities and mount it as a personal attack against psychologists understanding. Believe it or not we do have oaths Mom and we do follow them mine is to follow them to the hilt. If you wanted to make it personal and take on a world beyond you how do you take the hypothetical situation of calming down a nonverbal autistic child using the PEC system at a movie and or a family dinners night out? How do you keep a child with ADD/ADHD calm without their medication on a false negative testing performed when medications were used? Then explain to the school departments due to the mothers debating the child needs much more care because the mother denied the son the medications thinking it a medical practice to make money? How do you void out that damage done, you have heard enough of yourself, how do you explain that to a school department, to the OT's, Speech therapists, and various others that the child was denied medication, needs more testing, and needs to be placed back on medications. You know that is what we have to watch out for Mom we have drones trained that ADD/ADHD is not real until it happens to them and when it does the first thing is to deny medications because the family does not believe in that being a treatable medication and can be knocked out of a child. Take the hypothetical and answer me out I'm waiting, you wanted to attack psychology, and now you can answer. Also, if in such a fact if a child is diagnosed with ADD/ADHD do you simply deny the medication if it is your child?

Joe Ziehm
Lewiston ME
Live the life that you want to, do not believe those who fool you, and always question. Conservatives want all three lines deleted and replaced with Communist rhetoric.

ARoberts70's picture

I am the proud mother of 3

I am the proud mother of 3 boys and 2 have autism. 1 in 150 children are being diagnosed with autism, a neurological defect, in Maine every day! The nature of this disorder is complex and baffeling. No two children with autism has the same difficulties in life. There is no cure, no magik pill, and no way to ensure that the lessons taught are going to stick when put to the test.

What has this got to do with anything? ALOT! Just because the child in the store, restaurant, or other public setting is "throwing a fit" does not automatically mean that the parents are to blame! I am sick to death of people clicking their tongues and heaving their sighs in the direction of the mother struggling to get her shopping done with a screaming toddler. Why is it so easy to point the finger of blame and so difficult to stop a second and think, "Hmm, I wonder if that poor child has a medical reason for flipping out in a crowded noisey space? That mom is sure doing a wonderful job holding it together with what's going on." I can not begin to count the number of times I was out of essentials and HAD to get some shopping done only to have my youngest (and most afflicted child) flip out on me seconds upon entering the store. I am not from L/A, I had no friend base from here, I moved here with an ex-husband and was left a single mom. I had to shop when I had to shop whether it fit with his ability to "behave in public" at that moment or not.

And for as much as I am certain it bothered other patrons in the store to no end be assured I got mine. While all they had to do was listen to a tantrum I was bein g hit, kicked and sometimes bitten for my shopping efforts. But when you know no one in town and have no other way what are you suppose to do? Starve so others can shop more comfortably?

My children were all taught the same set of rules: No means no ; you don't hit ever ; you receive an age appropriate consequence for bad behavior. My children are grown now. Sadly my youngest is extremely limited and still struggles every day to remeber these rules when the "moment" strikes. That moment before you decided to act in the inappropriate way that will bring consequence. It is not a lack of parenting in all cases that creates this disruptive scene of inappropriate behavior, sometimes the child is not able to retrieve the lesson when needed. Maybe a little compassion here for the parents instead of a witchhunt would be a little more charitable.

verified

Kind of like the old gifted

Kind of like the old gifted and talented logic; the child's gifted and talented because he shuts up and does as he's told, that old favored logic, and without a deviation. Open up your eyes and buy a clue folks there are learning disabilities. Parents have to deal with this, this is not the time to expose the benefits of John Rosemund, and or Michael Savage on teaching children. How do you discipline a non-verbal autistic? Can you calm down a child with ADD/ADHD in public with discipline? Do whatever it takes no matter what leads to child abuse John. Of course discipline works with a disability its just a common trend from Gil's perspective. Discipline that's the answer of course stern with a nonverbal autistic and doing whatever if takes. Of course you all have degrees know the scaffolding limits, the ZPD of the child's intelligence, and the growing cause of how to handle disability situations. You know half of you do not take that into account and preach it as such a way to make it sound so easy. A great parentage tool discipline is in dualities it also accounts for spousal abuse, negative contrasts of drug reliance, and the predictive indicators of what the next generation will expose when raising their own children. We are addicted to ignorance of childcare and reform and this proves it.

Joe Ziehm
Lewiston ME
Live the life that you want to, do not believe those who fool you, and always question. Conservatives want all three lines deleted and replaced with Communist rhetoric.

jchick's picture
verified

Your logic, maybe. The point

Your logic, maybe.

The point that people are trying to make here is that kids will be kids. It is up to the parents to "train" them how to function in society. That involves love, support, reinforcement, correction, discipline and time. The fact that all kids are not the same or have more issues that others doesn't negate a parents responsibility. You do whatever it takes.

John A. Chick

"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be." -- Thomas Jefferson in a letter to Colonel Charles Yancey (January 6, 1816)

ARoberts70's picture

You are absolutely right and

You are absolutely right and absolutely clueless!

Right: "The fact that all kids are not the same or have more issues than others doesn't negate a parents responsibility." Well, duh! A proponderance of the parents I know with kids that have a disability (including myself and my husband) still have rules and boundaries and all of the correct parental behavior reinforcements as any other set of parents does. Unfortunately the child is not able to always live up to the expectation either because of a neurologic disfunction or because of a chemical imbalance that inhibits that part of the brain in certain circumstances.

Clueless: "You do whatever it takes." What is "whatever it takes" suppose to even mean?
Try this scenario. Little Johnny has MR from a brain injury from a car accident when a drunk driver hit him walking home from school. He looks 12 but he has the mind and behavior of a 2 yr old and in new surroundings he can become volitile. Johnny's parents are traveling to Grandma's, a very familiar place for Johnny. It is only a 2hour car ride so no need for a big to do as Grandma always has dinner waiting for them when they arrive. Awe.
But then out of nowhere they have car trouble . The car had been inspected just yesterday in preparation for the trip and all was fine but today the mechanic says that a rock was kicked up just right and knocked something loose. (bear with me on this I'm not a mechanic, but you get the point.) Now they will be delayed several hours and Johnny is getting hungry and restless. The only place they can remotely afford is the nice family sit down across the street but Johnny has never been there before.
They go in and all seems fine. They order and Johnny likes what is selected for him. But when it arrives his potato is touching his peas and this is just too gross. Johnny has a melt down. Because of his MR he doesn't get it that he can't behave this way in this space. His food is touching! What should the parents do? Beat him until he learns to eat what is put in front of him? Leave because he might be disturbing other patrons? Of course not. They should simply ask the waitress for a divided plate of food and try to calm Johnny by reminding him of Grandma's choclate cake she has waiting for them. In other words, they are going to do their best in this difficult situation and hope to hell closed minded people like you aren't there clicking your tongues and wagging your fingers at them in judgement of a situation that is both embarassing and difficult enough without bigotted people like you making them feel like lousy parents on top of it.

Shame on you! People of kids with a disability are not shirking their responsibility if their kid has a behavior related meltdown. It is beyond their and their child's ability most times to predict when or what will trigger it.

Nancy1's picture

Gil, I agree also. And let

Gil, I agree also. And let me add that in this day and age, when both parents work and the kids are being cared for by others, I think some parents simply do not spend enough time with their children to even know what works to help their child behave.
That said, children are different too and what works for one just doesn't work for another. I was a stay at home mom with three children. The oldest was very obedient and a joy to take out. The other two, until they were four or so, were just too rambunctious. It was no fun having to constantly discipline them in public, so I simply didn't take them out until they were older and had more self control.

triumph's picture

Yeah! A chance to agree with

Yeah! A chance to agree with Gil!

Gil's picture

How about allowing parents

How about allowing parents to discipline their children? Worked for my Mom. We knew what to expect if we acted out in public and it kept us in line. Worked for my kids too.
"A government big enough to give you what you want is strong enough to take everything you have." Thomas Jefferson

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