Death is not an 'essential' public service

A soldier is “essential” when alive. Not essential when dead?

Is that the official stance of the United States’ Congress and the Pentagon?

Apparently so.

Or at least it was until the politically-valuable court of public opinion erupted this week.

On Saturday, a 19-year-old American soldier was killed in Afghanistan. On Sunday, four more were killed there. The federal government — citing the shutdown — refused to pay to transport their bodies to U.S. soil, and delayed payment of death benefits to their families to help pay for funerals.

Ordinarily, the federal government wires $100,000 in death benefits to families within 36 hours of a soldier’s death so the families can plan funerals and take care of other immediate needs.

But for the families of soldiers killed during the shutdown — even though these soldiers were considered essential personnel up until the second of their deaths — no death benefits were to be paid until Congress lifts the shutdown.

That was lawmakers’ stand until Wednesday, when the U.S. House hurriedly voted 425-0 to restore the death benefits. What the Senate will do, and whether President Obama will sign the bill, remains to be seen.

Rather than having the bodies remain in Afghanistan, a number of private citizens and charitable groups, including Lead the Way Fund — founded by Jim Regan whose own son was killed in Afghanistan six years ago — paid to transport the bodies to the Dover Air Force Base where they were greeted by their families early this week.

Their actions are admirable.

The actions of their government?

Not.

Lance Cpl. Jeremiah Collins, an intelligence specialist, was stationed in Afghanistan's Helmand province when he was killed Saturday. A high school graduate from Milwaukee, Collins joined the Marine Corps in 2012.

Special Agent Joseph Peters, 1st Lt. Jennifer Moreno, Pfc. Cody Patterson and Sgt. Patrick Hawkins were all killed Sunday in a roadside IED attack by insurgents in the Zhari district in southern Afghanistan.

The 24-year-old Peters, who was from Springfield, Mo., was an Army Criminal Investigation Division special agent. His friend, Ian Tausig told the News-Leader that Peters — who was married and leaves a 20-month-old son — was “good.”

"The only word that I have is good,” Tausig told the newspaper, noting that he and others have donated money to Peters’ widow and will make sure his family is taken care of “until elected officials in the Capitol can get their act together.”

Moreno, a 25-year-old Army nurse from San Diego, was based at the Madigan Army Medical Center in Washington State when she volunteered to join a cultural support team that deployed to Afghanistan in June. It was her first deployment overseas. While alive, according to Army records, she had awarded the Parachutist Badge, Army Achievement Medal, National Defense Service Medal, Global War on Terror Service Medal and Army Service Ribbon. Posthumously, she has been awarded the Combat Action Badge, Bronze Star Medal, Meritorious Service Medal, Purple Heart, Afghanistan Campaign Medal and NATO Medal.

In a press release, Lt. Col. Patrick Ellis, commander of the 3rd Battalion, 75th Ranger Regiment, Ft. Benning, Ga., described Patterson — who lived in Oregon — as “the poster child for the Ranger Regiment. …  He was courageous and dedicated and lost his life while fighting tenaciously against our nation’s enemies alongside his fellow Rangers.” He was 24 years old.

Hawkins — Patterson’s fellow Ranger — was 25 years old and leaves behind a widow in Carlisle, Pa. A soldier who had earned more than a dozen medals and awards since his enlistment in 2010, he was serving his fourth tour in Afghanistan and was killed while attempting to save another soldier.

These five accomplished soldiers each volunteered to serve this country. Our government required them to stay on the job during the shutdown, and they did. And, when they died, we couldn’t come up with the funds to pay for their funerals? Or pay for their families to travel to meet their coffins?

That cannot be this country’s official stand. It does not represent the sentiments of the citizens, so how can it then become the actions of its government?

There’s a lot about the shutdown not to like.

But this?

This is an abomination.

This is posturing at its absolute worst.

This is utterly disrespectful to the men and women who we ask to serve this nation.

This disregards all civilized decorum and is just plain wrong.

We cannot, as a nation, tell the families of Lance Cpl. Jeremiah Collins, Special Agent Joseph Peters, 1st Lt. Jennifer Moreno, Pfc. Cody Patterson and Sgt. Patrick Hawkins that they were essential when alive but not essential when dead.

On Wednesday, according to USA Today, during his daily opening prayer in the Senate chamber, Senate Chaplain Barry Black, who is a retired Navy admiral, had some tough words for Congress: “Lord, when our federal shutdown delays payments of death benefits to the families of children dying on far away battlefields, it’s time for our lawmakers to say enough is enough.”

Amen to that.

jmeyer@sunjournal.com

The opinions expressed in this column reflect the views of the ownership and the editorial board.

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Comments

CLAIRE GAMACHE's picture

Disasters

We keep hearing what an unmitigated disaster the ACA is. Well it looks to me as if the real disaster is this Tea Party lead Congress. What could a health care law do to this country that is worse than putting a million people out of work, including nuclear power plant workers, food inspectors during a salmonella outbreak, plane safety inspectors, and FEMA workers during a million dollar disaster in the Dakotas, denying formula for babies, pre-school for toddlers, benefits for soldiers killed in battle, and disabled veterans, crashing the tourism industry near the parks, and threatening our credit which we have managed to keep A One for over 200 years? What can be worse than our elected representatives doing this to us over a principle then lying to us by saying others are to blame? What can be worse than our government inflicting all this pain on the citizens while the members of the Congress exempt themselves from the shutdown as well as the Sequestration? The horrors of health insurance exchanges and bad web sites pale in comparison.

Betty Davies's picture

I agree

I agree with Claire Gamache, who wrote, "the real disaster is this Tea Party lead Congress." The Tea Party's theme song is "Every man for himself, and the devil take the hindmost," closely followed by "I've got mine, so the heck with anyone else." We're starting to see how that works out in practice.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

You are presenting a false

You are presenting a false dichotomy. Tea Party want to get spending under control without taxing the hell out of everyone. You are just afraid that you will lose something you did not work for in the process. That is a bit selfish in of itself.

Betty Davies's picture

What, precisely, did I not work for?

I'd be willing to bet my own work history is longer than yours, so don't try to claim I haven't worked for Social Security.

My own tax dollars --and my husband's--have always gone toward constructing and maintaining the social safety net, which came in handy when one of our children was born with a disabling genetic disorder. If anyone in your family is disabled, or if you or someone you love becomes disabled, my tax dollars will be going toward their MaineCare, SSI, and/or Medicare--which is fine with us.

Whenever the notion of ending special tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires comes up, the TP retort is always that liberals want to raise taxes on "everyone." A false and misleading assertion.

Steve  Dosh's picture

Death is not an 'essential' public service

Mainers , 18:40 est ?
We agree ? 
hth , Steve
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

See, Steve? In the old days

See, Steve? In the old days you could have just clicked on AGREE and it would've been done for you. Now, you had to type it in. Don't it suck?

Steve  Dosh's picture

Paul , Hahahah -- ' the good

Paul , Hahahah -- ' the good 'ole days ' . Life sucks . Then we die . L O L
Hey . .i was just in the Great State of Maine over the past several weeks and had a - w o n d e r f u l - time , seriously
What you guys ( and girls , men , women , kids - everyone ) do well is prepare for the holy-days such as Halloween and Thanksgiving \ Christmas . Really . i thoroughly enjoyed myself Every minute of it
BßbBRrr. .though , and you guys are experiencing a heat wave now , huh ?
/s , Steve

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Anything over 47 degrees and

Anything over 47 degrees and the T-shirts, shorts and sandals come out.
I've always felt that Halloween preparations were premature and excessive, but that's just me. Glad to hear you enjoyed your visit.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

A glaring example.........

This is just a glaring example of how the Republican shutdown of the government, has drastically affected the constituents of this country. It shows how very little thought went into the possible circumstances to the people, while bragging amongst themselves of sticking it to the ACA. Just what price are the Republicans willing to extract from the people to attain their goals. It's disgusting and immoral.
If I hear John Boehner use the word "conversation" one more time, another one of my TV's may become the victim of an angry flying object.
It's time the Republicans suck it up, end their shutdown, and get this country back working again, put an end the game playing....................

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

I just love it how all you

I just love it how all you liberals are harping around acting as if only one party was involved in everything that's going on. Spin that Kool-Aid bottle, baby.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

I think the truth has been proven.........

John Boehner was caught red handed. He admitted to reaching a deal to with the President, to avoid the shutdown, only to take it upon himself to change his mind after realizing he might get some concessions from the President. Thus proving without a doubt, That not only is John Boehner the dumbest politician on the planet, he is responsible for the whole shebang, lock, stock, and barrel. Ever notice how he seems to be taking this the hardest??????????????????????

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Boehner is a dork, but he

Boehner is a dork, but he doesn't have a monopoly on the term.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Get used to it now buddy. If

Get used to it now buddy. If the government keeps spending at the current rate, some day the shutdown will be 100%, no only 15%. Moreover, you need to blame your friend in Whitehouse for spending unnecessarily to barricade open air parks. That is not the Republican's fault. It is your favorite president wanting to personal hurt you at the taxpayer's expense. I wonder who much money was wasted to barricade otherwise open air parks. You better bow to your master for he may smite you.

CAROLYN LIBBEY's picture

Oh where, oh where are

Oh where, oh where are grammar and spell-check?

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Wear do you think they our?

Wear do you think they our?

Brian Franck's picture

I think he meant to say....

Where do you think they are? But in all fairness, I don't think "spell-check" would help in Paul St. Jeans' case!

FRANK EARLEY's picture

Mark, your typing like your very upset............

First of all, 15% or 100%, the shutdown was entirely the Republicans fault, It was their plan all along, they got caught. The Government can't possibly keep spending at the current rate, have you ever noticed that every year a whole lot of thing become more expensive. There's no trick to it, it's been happening since the days of trading beans. Everything gets more expensive, it's how some of us make a little money on the side. It's no secret. The Whitehouse is not spending anything to keep the open air parks,(otherwise known as National Parks) closed. They are closed because the Republican Party has decided to shut down the Federal Government. The Federal Government pays to keep those parks open. No Government, no parks, simple as that. Also, if you go to a National Park and it isn't open, that means you can't go inside. The place is closed, not barricaded. I honestly don't feel that my President is trying to hurt me at my own expense. Unfortunately due to physical limitations, I'm unable to bow to anyone, as if I would in the first place.
Have a nice day...................

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Again, how much did it cost

Again, how much did it cost to barricade the open air parks? It certainly was not zero dollars. It is a non-negative amount; hence, it cost money.

Actually, many of the popular parks, like Arcadia and Yosemite generate millions of dollars positive cash flow. Closing the parks cuts off that revenue stream.

"Unfortunately due to physical limitations, I'm unable to bow to anyone, as if I would in the first place." Yet you can work a cord of wood? Something still sounds fishy.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

Here we go again........

The barricades were needed as a result of the Republican shutdown. What exactly is working a cord of wood? I had some trees cut down on my property and gave the wood to a friend, I wasn't to overworked by that.
Maybe this will satisfy your hunger for conspiracy. Way back after the fifth time I tried to go back to work, the insurance company people told me I could no longer go to work due to liability issues. In order to try and get around that decision, they offered me one last chance. They sent me to a well known Physical therapy facility in town. They proceeded to have me take what they call a functionality test, and a work place agility test. These tests took half the day and the results were immediate.
I tried like hell, I wanted to go back to work, well the results spoke for themselves. I didn't only fail the tests, I had people running in terror. The poor girl who administered the test, i think has since switched careers.
That was six years ago, and it's gotten worse since then, believe me no one wants me working near them..........................

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Perhaps the corporate office

Perhaps the corporate office knew gold digging was a corporate liability.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

So, you're saying the

So, you're saying the government needs to spend more because of inflation? Geez why didn't we think of that?

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

That is exactly what he is saying, just like economist

That leaves investment and government spending as the real engines of growth, and this is why I highlighted them in green. They are the forces that drive the business cycle rather than follow it. Businesses and the government together determine whether or not we are in rapid expansion or the depths of depression.

Something that appears to be completely lost in this discussion is that every cut in government spending represents a reduction in someone’s income. It has the same effect as an increase in taxes. How is this going to excite entrepreneurs about investing?

The private sector needs the injections of income that will create profits for those entrepreneurs and induce them to invest. Instead, we are about to further impoverish their potential customers.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johntharvey/2011/04/29/why-the-private-secto...

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Graph

MARK GRAVEL's picture

You do realize that Frank

You do realize that Frank bought a luxury SUV all while on SSDI?

JOANNE MOORE's picture

Coming from you, that is a joke!

Someone who would lie about military service. And we are supposed to think anything you say is important? Go back to your mother's basement little man.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

My service is public

My service is public information, so you are welcome and able to verify my service. Yet, then you would no longer have a bitching post.

God bless your family, they sure as hell need it.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

As long as he isn't breaking

As long as he isn't breaking any laws......

MARK GRAVEL's picture

I'm not saying Frank is

I'm not saying Frank is breaking any laws. Just an observation that something may be wrong with the system if this abuse, IMHO, is allowed to occur.

CAROLYN LIBBEY's picture

Sounds like a veiled

Sounds like a veiled accusation to me--be careful with your inuendos--lawyers thrive on that type of fodder.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

I needed that luxury SUV..............

To compensate while I'm towing my crappy boat. They kind of balance each other out............

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Hey, at least you have a

Hey, at least you have a boat, many Americans cannot even afford a "crappy" boat - all a matter of perspective.

I recommend that you do some salt water fishing with your boat. I bet you can get that SUV deep into the water on the boat launch.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

A rising tide lifts all

A rising tide lifts all boats.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

Hey, I spent hours..............

I spent hours on u tube, watching video after video of people backing their entire vehicles into the water trying to launch their boats. I'll say this, a rising tide may lift a boat, but I haven't seen a truck yet that floats ................

MARK GRAVEL's picture

The key is to launch in

The key is to launch in "salt" water. Perhaps you can also take the opportunity to wash the car in a raising tide.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Yes, but a boat will not

Yes, but a boat will not float on a sea of red ink.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Do the fishermen of the Red

Do the fishermen of the Red Sea know that?

MARK GRAVEL's picture

"The Whitehouse is not

"The Whitehouse is not spending anything to keep the open air parks,"

Perhaps you are not thinking clearly. You are telling the readers it costs nothing to install barricades? Is that because the government uses elves or something?

1. It cost money to rent said barricades.
2. It cost money to transport said barricades.
3. It cost money to set up said barricades.
4. It will cost money to remove them.

So tell, readers which republican picked up the phone and put this plan into action?

FRANK EARLEY's picture

I went to the Auburn Public Library..........

One day I went to the Auburn Public Library. I wasn't paying attention and went there, driving my luxury SUV, and realized it was a holiday or something and guess what, they had a closed sign up, in the window, on the locked door, nothing more needed. Must have cost a fortune. Parks are no different, you close the gate, you go home. whats the big deal?????????????

CAROLYN LIBBEY's picture

I think you'll agree with me

I think you'll agree with me Frank that some people just can't read or...............maybe its "selective" vision. Ha, ha.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

It appears you lack knowledge

It appears you lack knowledge of the concept of "open air park" - there are no locks. Locks hand to be installed just to give the appearance of shutting down the park.

For example, the WWII memorial has no gates.....

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Correction

Locks had to be installed just to give the appearance of shutting down the park.

 's picture

It not only that; they were warned

On September 27th three days before the shutdown, the Comptroller of the Army, I believe, stated that in the event of a shutdown the death gratuity could not be paid. The house later wrote a bill which passed to pay the military during the shutdown but did not include the gratuity. Only when it makes headlines do they react.
Never was a reason to force the shutdown in the first place much less leave the soldiers without pay or their unfortunate and grieving families without the gratuity. Remember many military families are on food stamps. They don't have money to fly around the country nor should they need to be concerned about this.
How can anyone trust a Republican from now on; they have deceived the country about the cause of the shutdown; they have tried to shift the blame on the Administration; and then to cover their tracks if anything makes headlines they vote to fund that and only that. These are completely irresponsible people who can not fulfill the responsibilities of their office.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Instead of trusting

Instead of trusting republicans we need to trust a democrat who believes he campaigned in 57 states and thinks a corpsman is a corpseman? Oh, o.k.

 's picture

May I make a modest proposal

No one should reply to Paul, Mark, or Dennis. While it may be fun to get knee-jerk surreal conversations going the reults are just absurd. These folks are not open to persuasion nor are they capable of independent thought. You would get better answers calling the RNC or better yet go directly to the source and call David Koch.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

As much fun as it is,,,,,,,,,,

I agree, my back and forth with Mark can be best described as arguing with tape recorder. No matter how many facts and possibilities you propose, he still comes back with the same thing over and over again. It's sort of like conversing with a wall. Now that I think about it, this must be pretty much the same situation the President and House Representatives must be dealing with down in Washington, pretty frustrating to say the least................

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

No matter how many times it

No matter how many times it is repeated, Frank, the truth is always the truth. Conservatives don't keep changing it in hopes of getting liberals to agree with them. Truth is truth.

Brian Franck's picture

And who defines that?

Certainly not you, Dumbo!

FRANK EARLEY's picture

Sometimes.......

The more it's repeated, the more it's believed to be the truth..........

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Frank the right wingers equate to just that, to their heroe of h

The quote is generally attributed to Dr. Paul Joseph Goebbels, who was Adolf Hitler's Propaganda Minister in Nazi Germany. It's also, in various forms, been used by and/or attributed to several people since... Including Lenin and various Chinese ministers.

Brian Franck's picture

Correction!

I believe that Lenin predates Goebbels.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Not your usual jovial and

Not your usual jovial and factual self this morning, Jon. A little too much cinnamon in the pablum?
Correct, I will not be persuaded by your robotical repetitions, nor will I ever be sipping from your delusional Kool-Aid jug. I do, however, enjoy your posts, Jon. You are one of the few from the left capable of expressing a complete thought articulately and without name calling.

Brian Franck's picture

In your case,...

name calling is necessary!

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

For the illiterate and

For the illiterate and emotionally challenged, perhaps. Your response to my post is proof of your inability to comprehend much since the post was clearly intended for another individual. Your response had no intent to it other than to be inflammatory; as usual.

Brian Franck's picture

Did I inflame you, Mr. St. Jean?

I knew the post was intended for someone else, but I wanted to get a rise out of you, I can plainly see it did!

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Humorous that you find no

Humorous that you find no fault with the current administration.

Brian Franck's picture

Simple Question!

If there are so many individuals who want to place the wholesale blame on the shoulders of the Republicans, then why is the price of gasoline in Maine currently not around the $1.60 per gallon mark it was back when Barack Obama was first elected president in 2008? In this matter, he has failed horribly!

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Oh my! It's Frack (or is it

Oh my!
It's Frack (or is it Frick) speaking out on economics, and I somewhat agree with what he is saying.

Brian Franck's picture

Yes, I'm back Gravelpit!

I have missed my daily conversations with Twiddle Dee and Twiddle Dumb!

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Yea, I bet you are one lonely

Yea, I bet you are one lonely puppy!

Brian Franck's picture

I prefer the company of cats!

I always enjoy the company of intelligent conversation, or should I have said unintelligible! I am just waiting now for Mr. Paul St. Jean to throw in his usual minus two cents.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Don't think I wasn't watching

Don't think I wasn't watching for you, douche bag. You finally posted something that made sense for a change.

Brian Franck's picture

I always make sense, it is you two bozos that don't!

Only women use a "douche bag", Dumbo.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

With one exception; whack

With one exception; whack jobs like you.

Brian Franck's picture

I guess...

it takes one to know one! Hey, where is Mark Gravel?

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Yep it was a simple minded question indeed

If gas prices were driven by decisions made in the White House, it’s a safe bet that any incumbent president would do everything possible to drive them lower ahead of a re-election campaign. With the possible exception of the unemployment rate or the Dow Jones industrial index, it’s one of the few numbers voters care most about when they head to the polls.

But while the notion that the government could somehow control gasoline prices is appealing, the reality is that the price you pay is set daily, sometimes hourly, by market forces around the world.

That was the opinion of a group of economists polled by the University of Chicago Booth School of Business earlier this year. Asked if changes in U.S. gasoline prices over the past 10 years have predominantly been due to market factors rather than U.S. federal economic or energy policies, not a single respondent disagreed.
________________________________________________________
Gas prices: There's not much that presidents can do about them
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/gas-prices-theres-not-much-presidents-ca...

Romney Admits Presidents Cannot Determine Gas Prices
http://news.firedoglake.com/2012/03/07/romney-admits-presidents-cannot-d...

What Measures Can The US President Take To Lower Gas Prices In The Short Term?
http://www.forbes.com/sites/quora/2012/10/18/what-measures-can-the-us-pr...

Obama Sets Gas Prices? Just Another G.O.P. Myth
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/18/opinion/sunday/obama-sets-gas-prices-j...

Brian Franck's picture

Yes, it was intended to be a SIMPLE-MINDED question!

Because the answer is so equally simple and obvious! But first, have you ever heard of anything so ridiculous as pricing one of our most precious commodities and natural resources by "chance", a kind of Russian roulette? In this country at least, we do not allow our utilities such as electricity or water to be priced on a "whim". Those entities have to receive approval from a statewide public utilities commission before changes are made. There is no such structure for oil. The whole concept of this "free fall" lack of control or regulation is totally absurd!

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Name the number of times a

Name the number of times a utility or water increase was denied?

Brian Franck's picture

You are missing the point!

It is not about whether an increase is approved or denied. It is about some sort of control rather than throwing the whole matter to the winds and hoping that "fate" will deliver a reasonable price.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

SM, The federal government

SM,
The federal government can in fact influence gas prices. It is as simple as Macro Economics 101 – the supply and demand curve.
Here is a real world example of how it works:

The State of California has more stringent gas blend requirements than Texas (and many other states for that matter). When the California Richmond Refinery shut down in 2012 due to a fire, the price of California gasoline skyrocketed (a shift in the supply curve). What made this problem worse is that California could not import gas surpluses from Texas at that time because the gas blend in Texas was not compatible with California law.

Lack of government policy establishing gas blends artificially restricted California’s gas supply for months.
Moreover, everyone who purchases gas pays the cost when a Refinery has to switch between manufacturing many different gas blends to satisfy state requirements. That cost is passed on to the consumer.

In closing, the Federal Government can set policy such that summer and winter gas blends are identical across the US. Moreover, the government can increase the potential supply pool if they cooperate with Canada to have interchangeable gas blends between the two countries.

A policy standardizing gas blends will allow gas supply to move to where the demand is located to stabilize if not lower gasoline prices.

This is just one real –world example of how policy can affect gas prices.

Brian Franck's picture

I prefer the more direct approach!

On his first day in the oval office after his election, Obama should have declared martial law and frozen the price of fuel oil and gasoline to what it was around that time in 2008. He could have then declared a national state of emergency and used military force to back this action up by holding the CEOs of the oil companies hostage as they are holding Americans hostage with these outrageous prices we are paying at the pump and to keep warm in our homes.
Furthermore, I believe that Adolf Hitler would have had a far more effective resolution to this government shutdown situation. He would have had the Gestapo arrest all of the Republicans in Congress and send them to Dachau, where the conditions there would have brought about a quick change in policy!

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Colors of Fascism

Good start to a bloody revolution there frack.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Looks like Brian's taken the

Looks like Brian's taken the wheels off his bus again, eh?

Brian Franck's picture

I do not have a bus!

And if I did, I certainly would not give you or Twiddle Dee a ride! I drive a Toyota Camry instead.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

You are being kind to imply

You are being kind to imply his bus had wheels in the first place.

Brian Franck's picture

Now would I do a stupid thing like you are suggesting?

No one in his or her right mind would get a bus without wheels! Boy! You say the dumbest of things, Mr. Gravelpit!

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

You got me on that one,

You got me on that one, buddy.

Brian Franck's picture

That's right!

Two peas in a "pod-duh", that's Twiddle Dee and Twiddle Dumb!

Brian Franck's picture

This revolution would be different!

It will no longer be about race or creed. This revolution will likely be between the "haves" and the "haves not", much like the French revolution. The poor and suffering peasants got tired of the lavish excesses of the wealthy aristocrats and found a perfect solution in the guillotine. Average Americans will also get fed up with the stupidity of congressional leaders and the rich, getting richer on the backs of the poor who are only getting poorer!

Brian Franck's picture

I thought it was about the Germans, not the Italians!

Do you really think, Mr. Gravelpit, that the United States will be spared another "revolution" and allowed to last as long as Hitler had envisioned his 1,000 year "Reich"?

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Hey

SFB, not saying that it doesn't, when it comes to refineries or blends....the point from the commenter was about the POTUS...stay focused, you still got your wifes panties in a twist, cutting off the circulation to your brain or from Frank having a SUV.

CAROLYN LIBBEY's picture

That comment after ....stay

That comment after ....stay focused" is WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY out there somewhere in the abyss.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

Welcome to my world.............

Hey Carol, this is the stuff I've been dealing with for a week now, just because I told Gravel I bought a shiny truck. You best be careful what you say or someone will get strangled with someones knickers in a bunch around their neck or Oh, hell, I can't figure it out either...................

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Believe me I don't lose sleep

Believe me I don't lose sleep over Frank's brand new luxury SUV.

I'm just shining the light on real-world example of a broken system. After all, Frank did air is laundry for all of us to see, so he opened the topic up for discussion.

Better living trough smaller government and entitlement means testing.

CAROLYN LIBBEY's picture

This drivel is real

This drivel is real confusing--you probably are losing sleep over the SUV.

FRANK EARLEY's picture

By jove, she's got it,,,,,,

We're all suffering from "Gravel Drivel".....................................

Brian Franck's picture

No Frank,....

I think we are all suffering from "Gravelpititis"!

FRANK EARLEY's picture

It's not brand new.............

It is shiny though......................

MARK GRAVEL's picture

Frank, stay away from the

Frank, stay away from the light.

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Remember Frank

He is a republican, only their kind are allowed to have the good things in life....the rest are not worthy to have material items and a roof over their heads and food in their bellies...

That is why I said they are only good use is fertilizer for just mushrooms since they like being in the dark and into smelly bedding from their own feces of BS.

That is why you see baggers driving clunkers with repub/teabagging bumper stickers holding up their vehicles together since they are too damn cheap to fix the rust, change the oil or the needed maintenance to keep them shiny and clean.

I was following this lady yesterday with my mother in-law going to the hospital where she pulled it too and she had a Bush/Cheney 08 and three other local baggers stickers. The car should not of been allowed on the road, period, from so much rust, fenders swaying and damage, which I told her so when she got out at the hospital....she gave me the typical Repub 1 IQ salute, dueling banjo bloodline response.....

MARK GRAVEL's picture

So having material things on

So having material things on the backs of future generations is a good thing?

Readers, this is a true progressive reviling himself. It is all about him, what material things he wants, not what is good for future generations.

I have much more respect for those talk about than you. At least they know how to sacrifice to maintain solvency.

All Jerry cares about is what material things he can acquire; what is the difference between you and the corporate elite that you hate?
I say not much.

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

Sure Mark

What ever you say, like as if we believe what you anal-yze out your patut that holds many dark waters....you grasp onto things just like water thru your itsy bitsy fingers....

MARK GRAVEL's picture

So tell the readers how long

So tell the readers how long can the government keep borrowing new debt faster than it retires old dept can last?

Can it last indefinitely?

If not, when will the system collapse on itself?

 's picture

I find lots to fault this administration

Primarily, the naive belief that Republicans want to do what's best for the country and therefore negotiations are possible in any circumstance. The nihilists, secessionits, anarachists, and terrorists within the Republican ranks are beyond simple negotiations. They must be dealt with as the President has this time.

PAUL ST JEAN's picture

Like forcing their hand at

Like forcing their hand at shutting government down and using his powers to inflict real pain on the American people, right?

JERRY ARIPEZ's picture

So in your

melted logic, it is ok for one to force the other but not other to do the same. Just like the other past pres who forced his hand onto others for his legacy of revenge for his daddy and domain of inflicting pain and death onto thousands in a war profiting melody of WMD with Cheney chants of "There is no exit plan for Iraq"...$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ It will pay for itself.....we will make billions from Iraq oil.....

The Shutdown Prophet
Instead, to the slowly unfolding horror of the Obama administration and even some segments of the Republican Party, the GOP decided that the alternative to finding common ground with the president did not have to be mere gridlock. It could force the president to enact its agenda. In January, Boehner told his colleagues he’d abandon all policy negotiations with the White House. Later that spring, House Republicans extended the freeze-out to the Democratic-­majority Senate, which has since issued (as of press time) eighteen futile pleas for budget negotiations. Their plan has been to carry out their agenda by using what they call “leverage” or “forcing events” to threaten economic and social harm and thereby extract concessions from President Obama without needing to make any policy concessions in return.

http://nymag.com/news/politics/nationalinterest/government-shutdown-2013...

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