Immigrants making a mark on Lower Lisbon

We are, we like to say, a nation of immigrants, a melting pot of cultures, nationalities and races.

It's what we, as Americans, do best — absorb and assimilate people from all the world's nations.

It's not, however, as if this has ever happened without friction. From African immigrants in Lewiston to Hispanics in Arizona, the process of bringing new people into the fold has never occurred without dissension.

If you "Wiki" the word " nativism," you'll quickly see what we mean.

When the first boat load of immigrants came to our shores, people on the second boat probably got a cold shoulder from the first group. It's human nature to feel threatened by or suspicious of anyone new or different.

The index to the Wiki entry shows the successive waves of nativism sentiment that occurred in the U.S.:

Anti-Catholic nativism in the 19th century

Anti-German nativism

— Anti-Italian nativism

Anti-Chinese nativism

Anti-immigration movements.

Amazingly, there is no mention of the people who most richly deserve to be angry about all this immigration — native Americans.

Of course, hostility toward newcomers isn't an American phenomenon.

Every country that has absorbed new people, willingly or unwillingly, has done so uneasily and sometimes accompanied by brutal violence.

The path of Somali immigrants, and other African groups in the Lewiston-Auburn area, seems to be following the usual pattern.

The new arrivals settle in the inner part of the city, usually where rental housing is the least expensive, and eventually begin building their own businesses there.

Several stories Sunday outlined the nascent transformation of Lower Lisbon Street in Lewiston as Somali businesses have begun to spring up.

This follows decades of decline along this city street, as outlined in a chart Sunday. In 1949, the city directory listed 97 buildings between 213 and 415 Lisbon Street.

That began to drop dramatically in the 1980s, particularly when the city of Lewiston changed its zoning rules to prohibit liquor-license holders within 500 feet of each other.

In 1980, there were still 71 businesses on the street, but by 2009, that had dwindled to just 24.

Today, however, there are 36 businesses in that area, reflecting a dozen new ones operated by immigrant Americans.

Hussein Ahmed is the proud owner of an older building  at 263 Lisbon St., where he has established Barwaqo Halal Market.

Ahmed, 37, left Somalia as a youth to escape war. He has lived in a refugee camp in Kenya, came to the U.S. in 2001, to Maine in 2002 and opened his store in a different location in 2004.

He is working on a degree from the University of Southern Maine's Lewiston-Auburn College.

"Lewiston is becoming home," he told the Sun Journal. "Trying to become successful means owning your own property."

A century ago, he could have been a Greek, Irish, Franco or Lithuanian working hard to establish his small stake in the American dream.

His experience is mirrored by that of others along Lower Lisbon Street who are operating restaurants and stores, who share the desire to raise and educate their children here and build better lives for themselves.

Some will succeed and, yes, some will fail. All will face the extra challenge of being a stranger in a new land.

editorialboard@sunjournal.com

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Comments

Warren5874's picture

Former immigrants had to work for a living.

Editor says, “A century ago, he (Ahmed) could have been a Greek, Irish, Franco or Lithuanian working hard to establish his small stake in the American dream.”

Not exactly. A century ago, Ahmed would have to work for a living. Government did not give immigrants food, clothing, shelter, health care, education, jobs, and Affirmative Action. Government did not give non-white rights superior to whites. Big difference. It’s disappointing to find editor forgetting, or naïve, to such things.

Warren5874's picture

Somalis come here to escape war?

Editor says, “Ahmed, 37, left Somalia as a youth to escape war.”

Mexico is richer than 80% of the rest of the world. Mexicans come here to escape poverty. Most of the world is at war (wars waged by Muslims) There are wars all over the world. It’s possible that 4 billion people are exposed to war, famine, suffering, disease, and miserable living. Four billion is 4,000 million. America’s population is about 310 million. How many poor people are you willing to support? How many more can we support on the dole in Lewiston? Do you think your taxes are not that high?

Bangladeshis are some of the poorest people on earth. Perhaps we need more multicultural mix and diversity. We need a few thousand Bangladeshis, and few thousand Congolese, and a few thousand Afghans. Would that make editor happy? Why exclusively Somalis?

There is no evidence in human history that a highly diversified people have been successful. Diversity divides. This lesson is found in the Bible in the story of Babel. Read it for yourself. It is how God wants things. No good deeds go unpunished. Our compassion for Somalis can only bring us distress and regret, if we wait long enough. As time goes by, they will gripe for ever more benefits and privileges and concessions. They will get their prayer in school while Christians are forbidden from theirs.

Chances are that none of us are responsible. Nor are the Somalis. They saw an opportunity, and weakness, and grasped it. The leadership who mixed us, you can bet, don’t have Somalis in their back yard nor anywhere near their neighborhoods. Our leadership has betrayed us. They failed to protect, defend, and preserve our culture, the culture of the Founding Fathers.

Warren5874's picture

Why don't Native Americans complain?

Editor says, “Amazingly, there is no mention of the people who most richly deserve to be angry about all this immigration — native Americans.”

That may be because we’ve mostly killed them all and pushed the rest off to reservations. Native Americans know on which side of their bread is buttered. It is whites who are the goose laying their golden eggs. It is not minorities, and aliens, stuffing our national treasury from which the largesse comes for handout programs. The top poorest cities in America are those in which whites are a minority.

When Somalis moved into Lewiston, there were about 2,000. Now there are 4,000. Tomorrow, 8,000. How many thousands in your lifetime? While we kill our babies, Somalis have large families and keep coming. The future belongs to that culture which replaces itself. Are you sure you won’t need a prayer rug before you die?

And curiously, blacks with a very unemployment rate also don’t complain. That baffles me.

Warren5874's picture

Is it a good idea to replace our aborted babies with immigrants?

Editor says,”We are, we like to say, a nation of immigrants, a melting pot of cultures, nationalities and races.”

Yes, today we are. But this only is so beginning since the mid 60. It was at this time that we changed the immigration laws. Prior to this, immigration was strictly controlled to allow only a proportion of minorities, non-whites into our country.

Editor says, “ It's what we, as Americans, do best — absorb and assimilate people from all the world's nations.”

I disagree. We encourage the immigrant to retain his culture. I see Somalis walking the streets wearing scarves. They are building their mosques. They petition for hours in school in which to pray to Allah. This is not assimilation. It won’t be long before they seek shariah law in their community. Assimilation means working and paying taxdes (income) Are they paying taxes?

The world frowns at our excessive consumption level, and pollution. We’ve killed 50 million of our babies to keep a low population level and lowered level of consumption and pollution. How does it help to replace our dead babies with immigrants?

Auburnkid's picture

Soap Box

Get it here first Folks!! HOT OFF THE PRESS .Lewiston Sun Journal changed it name to Somali Son.First issue will be in news paper dispenser, on corner of lisbon and main st. Friday Sept 3.

concerned KD's picture

EXTRA! EXTRA! READ ALL ABOUT

EXTRA! EXTRA! READ ALL ABOUT IT!!! "SOMALIS SAVE SUN JOURNAL".

BenHarrison's picture

MARK it's More like a

MARK it's More like a STAIN!!!

Minime44's picture

It's called ADA (Americans

It's called ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act), A 1990 federal law that forbids discrimination against persons who are disabled.

fixit001's picture
verified

Please tell the whole story

Please tell the whole story not just your side !!!! please tell us without fibbing how many stores are opened with goverment funds. And really we are talking 12 stores according to your article Wow according to you its a lanslide there were over 70 in 1980 what you failed to point out with all your insane wisdom was that the council and development officials who still manage to mess things up due to incompetence was downtown beautifacation project while 100% of all bussiness counted on traffic the wisdom of our leaders was to limit traffic then almost overnight lisbon street was avoided like the plauge and immediately the bussinesses started to close. and thank god the development and the council figured it out before they put a STUPID CLOCK IN THE MIDDLE OF ASH AND LISBON INTERSECTION now that would have gone down in the books as "what stupid is stupid does!".

Rinoblast's picture

Ya folks. Let's be mad about

Ya folks. Let's be mad about immigrants opening up ethnic shops. I mean that Italian Bakery is so in your face with their name and their style of cooking. Why don't they just open an American bakery?

And FYI, just because you like their donuts doesn't mean they're any different than a Somali store.

Robert OReilly's picture

Except that the doughnuts at

Except that the doughnuts at the italian bakery don't cost twice as much as DD's or Timmies.
and the owners don't immediately look down on you when you're just browsing.

mbthedragon's picture

Are they allowed to save

Are they allowed to save their loose change in a Piggy Bank?

BenHarrison's picture

Sun Journal what is with all

Sun Journal what is with all the Pro Somali propaganda. You refuse to print articles that are anything other then feel good fluff about them. No Stories about the Somali gang, it took 8 months for you guys to print one story about the gang of Somali teens jumping people on the streets!! This is America we don't care where you came from what colors your skin is, but put on a pair of Levi's, pledge allegiance to the flag, have a barbecue on the 4th of July, put up some kind of decorations in December, complain about taxes,eat some damn turkey in November!! In other words American UP!! Be careful I am sure walking into Barwaqo Halal Market with your service dog, Munching on a Simmons red hot dog would be a hate crime!! They don't want to be a melting pot they do not want to be Americans they want to be Somalis in America. They are a salad bowl, they don't want to live in America they want to create Somalia here in America.

thinkingman's picture

Its not just the LSJ, ever

Its not just the LSJ, ever notice that all the calls by police to handle Somali disturbances in some of the projects like River Valley never get reported in the paper...

Robert OReilly's picture

and that melee that occured

and that melee that occured in the emergency room at CMMC. No article, nothing; just 1 disorderly conduct charge in the police log. Cheers!

Zkot's picture

In part

Mr. LaFlemme might be able to answer your question directly , I asked once why he only wrote one sided crime articles , his response was ( and Im gonna quote here ) I write what LPD tells me too , those are the facts Im given , and dont lie mark , that was your response on hopes front porch

Zkot's picture

sorry Mark

LaFlamme not LaFlemme

Zkot's picture

lessons from the past

Seems to me I remember a time not so long ago when a mayor said no more free ride and was accused of being a bigot and a racist , I dont wonder why anyone of any importance is "AFRAID" to stand up and speak the truth , the newspaper is a non biased form of information , their view isnt always gonna match up with yours or mine , I agree about the "Fluff" thats being spread , human interest or whatever they wanna label it , has always had it's place in local papers , Not to mention if they did say something bad and someone stupid ( Like there isnt a few of those around lewiston ) did something horrible , who's on the receiving side of that lawsuit ......

Zkot's picture

whats to disagree?

The fact the mayor got raked over the coals , that someone stupid might live in Lewiston ( Im sure we all remember the Hogs head incident ) , That they wouldnt sue everyone and everything involved ?? Im lost , or is it that the paper isnt afraid to write about negative lights in the Somali community?

CharlieBrown's picture

Glad I left

So glad I left Lewiston 16 years ago after having been born there and spending more than half of my life there. Not because of the immigrants, but because of the intolerant people like the ones posting here. My gosh, seems like every problem in the State is because of the Somali immigrants. There couldn't possibly be any other group in Maine getting the SAME benefits as they are. The fact that they are utilizing the store fronts on Lisbon St. is a great thing for Lewiston. They pay rent and more importantly having a licensed business they are bringing in revenue to the city and state even if 'the average American' isn't shopping there. Seems like many of the yahoos posting here would rather have empty, run down, vandalized store fronts like there used to be instead of those helping out the community. This Country is a Nation if immigrants. I am only 3rd generation from Croatia and Poland. My grand-parents came here legally to seek a better life from the ills they faced in their homeland. The Somali people are doing the same. When the Poles, Irish, German, etc. groups first came to the US they sought out their own people so they could 'fit it.' Over time they because more American than where they came from, but that didn't happen over night. The same thing will happen with the Somali immigrants and other groups over time.

jmyoung's picture
verified

I really object, no mention

I really object, no mention of "the Irish need not apply" signs were everywhere during the exodus from the potato famine. Never mind "Irish Catholics", more Irish people were indentured than any other immigrant group. oh no. Franco Americans were abused worse than anyone in these communities that I know of. Remnants of this was and is still around, it was very prevalent until the late 70's early 80's. I think the Somali community is like any other immigrant group, they are suspicious, frightened and want to be left alone. I also think they are making great strides in assimilation. Actually far quicker than the afore mentioned immigrant groups. (which I am a part of)

seekingthetruth's picture

oh really? What country did you immigrate from?

So many people here claim to be "Irish" or "French" or "Italian" when in fact, they were born here making them Americans.

Irish, French and Italian are nationalities not races. If you were born in Italy, then you aren't Italian. Get it?

But if you are foreign born I would like to know about your immigration experience.

Mac antSaior's picture
verified

Irish is an ethnicity within

Irish is an ethnicity within the Celtic race. If you are in America as an Irish descendant, you are Irish more than you are American. The term American refers to neither ethnicity nor race but rather a people belonging to a set of political and cultural rules and mores (mostly borrowed from Europe). In many ways we are as artificial as the former USSR which was a social construct, not a people. To truly be "American" you would have to be a descendant of native blood (North American). Since I am not of any native American tribe but my family came from Ireland, then I am of Ireland. I live in the American culture but I am, in fact, an ethnic Irishman of the Celtic race.

seekingthetruth's picture

Excuse me for the error above^

it should read:

If you weren't born in Italy, then you aren't Italian.

Zkot's picture

Stop blaming the people

you wanna point blame at someone , look in the mirror , the somali community didnt create the welfare system in wich they exploit , nor did they jump on the Maine boat , Our elected officials are to blame as much as we are for putting them in office. Stop yelling Somali this and Somali that , white people have been on welfare as long as it's been in service , look at yourselves first , we the people elected officials who made the best kool aid for the time , now the flavor has changed and no one is happy ............ get informed before you jump places ( NAFTA ) remember how great the idea was . Then all of a sudden it backfires , I dont blame the people of mexico for taking my job , I blame myself for electing the idiot official who gave it away , I suggest you do the same and soon you will see things change , until then keep your hot air to yourselves , or get up and do something about it , thats my opinion like it or not

seekingthetruth's picture

Yes, we had welfare before the Somalins got here

But it is our welfare system, not theirs.

I paid taxes for years to support "our welfare" system, the Somalians have never paid.

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

sounds rather infantile. get

sounds rather infantile. get over it. its america-been this way before we were ever born.

Zkot's picture

Missed the point

Well Seek what your doing is exactly why I posted this comment , I dont post often , when I do I dont "Fluff" , The problem isnt theSomalians or even the somalians being on welfare , it's welfare allowing people to not work but still have the things a large percent of us struggle and work hard to get , get educated , get informed , heres a wise word from Koran , Allah gave you two eyes two ears and one mouth , pay attention to everything , complaining about a people who were brought here isnt gonna make things any better , as a matter o fact public forums allways help prompt the "Mob Mentality". Bad enough the few that are here that are working to make a better life for their kids cant get ahead because so many exploit the system , ELECT OFFICIALS WHO WILL DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT , use your "American " voice for something other than the poor me , I pay taxes too , I support them also , so does alot of lewiston , dont make me special , dont even give me a soap box to stand on , 90 percent of the time im on board with most of your comments , do me a favor re read the post .

seekingthetruth's picture

Can anybody show me proof that the Somalians

have improved our quality of life?

have made our economy better?

have made any positive contribution to our society?

respect us as a Nation and as a people, and are not just using our Constitution as an excuse to exploit us?

And I mean real proof, not opinion.

Pirate's picture
verified

Can you hear the sound of

Can you hear the sound of crickets in the backgroung, Seek? There is no proof.

thinkingman's picture

Seeking, I hate to do

Seeking, I hate to do it...but many landlords are thrilled to have tenants as at one time not so long ago they suffered from a 40-50% vacancy rate.....

seekingthetruth's picture

Granted, but

other than the few shop owners on Lisbon St, what do the other 3000 somalians offer?

And btw, rent for a few landlords does not really make much of a contribution to the city as a whole.

seekingthetruth's picture

And the shop owners

may pay some rent to local landlords, but they don't offer anything for sale that the average American buys.

So, again. what do they contribute to the city as a whole?

Rinoblast's picture

You could ask this question

You could ask this question of every ethnic group in the early years of their migration (and yes, this is still early). How about the benefits of learning about a new culture? If you haven't gained this benefit, it's because you aren't trying. Every year there are multiple festivals open to all members of the community to learn about the various cultures in Lewiston.

Many people also demand that immigrants get jobs and forget that the jobs just aren't here any more. It's hard for everyone to get work, let alone someone with little money and cultural experience in this country. Like most immigrant groups, it's really the next generation who makes the sea change. And if you ever notice the news releases in the city section of the SJ from CMCC, CMMC, and USM you'd see what I mean.

thinkingman's picture

Seeking, dude chill out, i

Seeking, dude chill out, i agree with you for the most part but you asked and I answeed your question...not liking the answer doesn;t mean its incorrect...keep tat up and we'll be calling you a liberal...

jeffyd's picture
verified

im just waiting to see what

im just waiting to see what happens the first time a blind person tries to enter one of those store with his seeing eye dog? Somalies HATE dogs consider them unclean and cant even touch one by religion.

Robert OReilly's picture

Haha yes! Every time I'm at

Haha yes! Every time I'm at RDA on Adams ave getting my car fixed, there is always a Somali or five hanging around. They freak out whenever another patron (or Doris) brings their dogs in!

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

if that is their religious

if that is their religious though then its their right. i would not take my dog in their store-its disrespectful.

concerned KD's picture

No its NOT their right!!!

It is NOT their right to descriminate against the blind with service dogs due to their religious beliefs..... That is like saying as a devout catholic i refuse to allow gays/lesbians to eat at my restaraunt.... If you own a business then you must allow all to be patrons of your store if they so choose.... You are saying descrimination is ok if it is based on religious beliefs..... Talking about ignorance, I would have to say that is the MOST IGNORANT comment ive read from you yet!!!! Next you will be saying it is ok for them to not allow any non muslims to shop in their store either, because according to the word of Mohamed any non believer of Allah is an infidel and must be cleansed from the earth until there are only Allah worshiping Muslims left, and they are not worthy of the gifts that allah provides in their stores. Thank you for your comment though because you just illustrated the liberal double standard that is going on with regard to muslims in this country.. By making this statement you show us all that the liberal view is to ostracise those who may be construed or interepreted to be descriminatory towards muslims, all while giving the muslims the green light to descriminate and violate the civil rights of the american people because their religion tells them to.... AS AN AMERICAN YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR COMMENT. If you are against descrimination, there should be no conditions to it... Not religious conditions, Not sexual orientation conditions, Not color of skin conditions, NO CONDITIONS....

Ask yourself, what if you were diagnosed tomorrow with severe epilepsy and the only way you could be prepared for your siezures is to have a service dog that can prompt you before they occur... Now you want those pretty skirts you are so fond of and maybe some of those triangle meat/veggie filled snacks you like but your condition doesnt allow you to go anywhere without this dog.. Would you allow them to descriminate against you because you have a disorder that makes the dog neccessary to your welfare, and agree it is their religious right to deny you entry to their store.

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

i have a service dog and like

i have a service dog and like i said-i would NOT bring my dog into their stores (someone with even allergies) because it is disrespectful.

concerned KD's picture

Dissrespectful vs ILLEGAL

Not wanting a dog in their store for medical reasons(allergies) vs religious beliefs are COMPLETELY different things. If you personally want to let them violate your civil rights to make yourself fell good about being respectfull to them than that is your peroggative.. Apparently your service dog is not a neccessity to your well-being but rather a novelty addition to your treatment of whatever ails you.. But if this were your seeing eye dog, it would be different... If they want to run a buisiness in this country they need to abide by ALL laws that apply to businesses such as the American With Dissabilities Act. That makes it illegal for any business to descriminate against or not allow access to their business by those who are dissabled.. Period.. Religious belifes DO NOT exempt anyone from LAWS...
If it did then why are those such as the devil worshiper Charles Manson in prison for murder? He could have argued his religion told him to make a human sacrificeand his religious beliefs are protected..Reality is RIGHTS ARE NOT ABSOLUTE!!!!
I would recommend that not all of your oppinions be based on the warm fuzzy you get from letting others do what makes them feel good by stomping on your rights. Sometimes logic must overrule emotion.. In my oppinion if they dont allow your dog then they dont deserve your business.. Remember if they really had their way(according to the Qaran) you wouldnt be able to have that dog and if you didnt believe in Allah and the word of Mohamed you wouldnt be fit to breath Allahs air.. Think about it. Does any other religion preach intolerance or destruction of anything not of its faith...

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

thanks for trying to school

thanks for trying to school me-but i am extremely well-versed on the state law and the u.s. government law on service dogs. my personal preference and personal belief is to be kind to another human being and respectful of them. i can put aside my needs for 5min. cuz in life its not all about me. it doesn't get a person far in life with that mentality. i have a friend who is muslim and the only thing they have ever said to me was that dogs should be outside... nothing about not being able owning a dog.

Pirate's picture
verified

Building a mosque on ground

Building a mosque on ground zero is not disrespectful, though, huh?

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

i have an issue with the

i have an issue with the thought of a world trade center being built upon ground zero-that is disrespectful. 2 blocks to 2 miles away-i can understand why there is talk of a mosque being built. its def a hot topic. i can certainly understand and appreciate the meaning of why some want it to be done. almost a 'we're past the stereo-types/hate/misunderstanding that all muslims are facing (being scrutinized for someone else's wrong... doing)-we come in peace and sympathize and empathize-we are for america and the american people. we have muslim-americans all across our country that are being denied a right to build a place of worship just because they are muslim. it is unjust at its finest. i just wish we can get past all this... all prejudices and stereotypes. no religion is better than another, no belief is better than another. all religions are quite parallel and similar to one another in more than a few ways. my hometown has many muslims/somalians and i HAVE to speak up when i hear of people bashing them. i can't stand it. no matter if its to my friend or my own mother-i will speak up. i know how it feels to be judged... unfortunately because of people who may share the same thought process and want to penalize ALL muslims because of A group which has NO affiliation directly to the events that happened... these muslims-people who bleed the same as you or i-are being denied the RIGHT to build mosques ALL across the united states. My friend has said it best:

"I asked Greg what he thought about the Mosque in NYC.... This is what he wrote... "Maybe we should remember the way that America was conquered was when the Spanish came to the culturally advanced Aztec civilization, they explained to the Native People that they were savages who had not been saved according to the Christian religion. Therefore, were not worthy of life unless they converted to Christianity which included giving up all of their gold and submitting to the Spaniards rule. This is another example of the abuse of religion to promote the agenda of a misguided group. The fallacy of the argument against building a mosque is the assumption that the people who attacked us on 9-11 are the same people who plan to build this mosque. Jim Jones took a group of christian devotees to Guyana and forced the entire group to commit mass suicide, killing more than 900 people. Would you let a christian church be built in your neighborhood after such an atrocity committed by someone of the same religion? One of the core tenants of American law, and English law, is the right of property and the right to purchase, own, and develop property as we see fit. If we abrogate this right for one group who will stop someone from taking this right from you? Countless Americans of all races, creeds and religions have fought and died for this right. To take it away from one group is to threaten all the rights in our society. If we forget or fail to defend the rights enshrined in our most basic law, the Constitution of our nation, we move down the road toward totalitarianism, the ability of one segment of society to usurp the rights of another. This is what the Nazis did to the Jews. Express your indignation all you like, this is another ...important right of Americans, but don't break the most fundamental law of our land."

concerned KD's picture

This is a quote from your

This is a quote from your post:
One of the core tenants of American law, and English law, is the right of property and the right to purchase, own, and develop property as we see fit.
You are wrong, It is NOT your right to develope your property as you see fit. We as a community have what is called ZONING LAWS... These laws are what keeps residential and commercial properties from encroaching on each other... The Zoning Laws in place prior to 9/11 are not fitting to the community of today.. This tragedy cuts deep into the hearts of Americans and should be respected by all.. The zoning for ground zero should be changed to not allow any churches/mosques/temples to be built anywhere near it... This space should be used to memorialize those who were lost on that horrific day,and those who paid the ultimate price fighting for this country in Afghanistan and Iraq, and become a symbol of the strength and determination of America, to show the world our way of life will not be threatened by any who oppose us..
As far as comparing todays cultural divide to that of the spanish and the Aztecs, you need to get with reatity.. We are notthe spanish. We are not trying to assimilate them into believing our religions. We are not trying to take away their beliefs (unless they violate our LAWS).. We are asking for the respect deserved by those who died on 9/11 to be given by all..

tron's picture

They are NOT building a mosque

ON ground zero, it's two freaking blocks away. Get your facts straight, stupid! Or ask your bird, it appears to know its facts.

Pirate's picture
verified

That's right, Troll; they

That's right, Troll; they aren't building that mosque; period.

Pirate's picture
verified

WALK THE PLANT....IMBECILE

WALK THE PLANT....IMBECILE

concerned KD's picture

yeah me too.. It would

yeah me too.. It would Probably be considered a hate crime and the blind person arrested and charged..

vzep's picture

Al-Shabab

Let's hope none of them are pooling their money and sending it to their homeland to
support al-shabab which has suspected ties to al-qaeda. Before anybody flames me,
be aware that this is not an accusation just a legitimate concern. It's already happening
in other parts of the country.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2010/08/american...

seekingthetruth's picture

I'll just be honest here

I want Lewiston back the way it was. The Somalians could have settled anywhere, why did it have to be here?

I couldn't care less about Somalian culture, I care about my culture.

I Know they are here to stay, but I still don't like it.

Lewiston was way better off before they got here.

And alot of people feel just like I do.

Frostproof's picture
verified

They settled here because

They settled here because Georgia puts a real time-limit on welfare benefits. The were welcomed here under the assumption that they would be good Democrats.

Pirate's picture
verified

It all started when Tara was

It all started when Tara was mayor and Catholic Charities got involved. Both parties were very involved in the process of getting Somalis to Lewiston. I always suspected there were Federal dollars for Lewiston that were attached to each individual Somali that came to Lewiston.

Joseph's picture
verified

Complain all you like . . .

but as I read these comments, I'm struck by the general tone of dismay and dislike for LA's Somali population. Like it or not folks, they are here to stay and like most immigrant families that came before them, they'll make their homes here, raise their families here and eventually (and hopefully) thrive here. Just keep in mind as you all minge and complain of their existence you should realize that LA's Somali population are not expected to change to your flippant whims and desires. Someday (and sooner than later) all of your complaints will fade away into distant echos, so nobody will remember how virulent many of you sound.

thinkingman's picture

"like it or not" is hardly a

"like it or not" is hardly a warming way of welcoming them...frnakly you're no better than anyone else and I'd bet you complain about the newest immigrants as much as others.

Frostproof's picture
verified

You're not reading very well, Joseph.

Many folks exhibit a general tone of dismay and dislike for immigrants who won't make even a token attempt to assimilate into existing society. Somalis are just the latest example of a group that, in general, expects all the rest of us to bend over backwards to accommodate the trappings of the society they escaped from, but dragged with them when they came here to have a "better" life.

Someday (and sooner than later) all of your flippant advice will fade away into distant echos, so nobody will remember how condescending you sound.

Joseph's picture
verified

Sounds a little too harsh to me . . .

And don't your comments sound much like the ones used to describe every other immigrant group that came to the United Sates? In the 1850's, protestant Bostonians called Irish immigrants "the slime on our shores". Sounds pretty hateful doesn't it? Doesn't it seem LA's Somali population are enduring the same vitriolic diatribes as the Irish and French once had? I'm certain that most of you all don't know one Somali in town. If you did, than perhaps you'd think twice before you rant and rave as you have.

Gary52's picture
verified

thinkingman, Camden National

thinkingman, Camden National has an ATM, to name one, which is the one I referred to in my earlier post. I see you are VERY familiar with the neighborhood and it's people.LOL, go down there sometime, then you can post from at least some brief experience.

thinkingman's picture

Gary i park at Centreville

Gary i park at Centreville and can see camden from my office....but you mentioned Lisbon and chestnut, not Canal and Chestnut, thus my question...that being said, I stand corrected, the address you provided threw me off...lets agree many people use that ATM on the 3rd of the month and not just Somalians, and many who use it should get off their backsides and actually work for a living.

concerned KD's picture

Anyone on here

Anyone on here (non-somali)ever try to go shop at these Somali stores?? What was your experience? What was the level of customer service? were you greeted when you walked in the door ? Did the store operator even have a smile on his/her face when they saw you enter they're store? Did they try to somewhat educate you about some of the items in their store that maybe you would appreciate and purchase?? Was there a demeanor change in the clerk or other immigrant customers?

Maybe the sunjournal should do a hidden camera expose on these questions, and print that in they're paper.. Might be an eye opening experience for them.. Maybe they would have some real truth to their stories on the Somali culture in Lewiston...
I support LEGAL IMMIGRATION, but why dont they want to come here to take part in our culture rather than try to change our culture to suit their ideals.. If they're cultural society actually worked then wouldnt they be happy to stay in they're country.. But it doesnt work and now they want to bring it here and inject it into our society.. Whats next? warlords running downtown Lisbon st? Every Somali immigrant is granted the right to have an AK47, since it is a cultural way of life in somalia for every 10 yr old to own an AK47 who are we to stop them from practicing they're culture here in the U.S.

jayla's picture

Are you kidding me with the

Are you kidding me with the customer service?! Walk into nearly any store in L/A and the customer service is seriously lacking! (Walmart, Kmart, BJ's, etc)

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

i've actually bought

i've actually bought sambousa/samboosa(?) its like this fried triangle thing with meat and i believe onions and peppers. i first had some when i worked with some friends of mine (who i love dearly) who are actually somalian. they are sooooo good! so delicious! i've also went into some stores to buy some skirts. they are the best skirts i've ever spent money on... the fabrics are just gorgeous! everyone manages their store differently... no matter somalian or not-there are just some store managers/owners who are not so personable. does it ever occur to anyone that they just might have their guard up because of the discrimination they have had to endure while being here. no one is really standing with open arms-they can only complain, complain, complain... furthermore that is the beauty of living in america. we are a melting pot and no one HAS to conform to the u.s. way other than obeying the law. ignorance must be bliss-ak47? are you serious?

concerned KD's picture

If you would like a lesson in

If you would like a lesson in the blissfullness of ignorance I encourage you to buy a boat and put all your worldly posessions in it and try to sail it around the horn of africa for a bit.... When someone pays your ransom and they release you then you will be properly educated in the true Somali culture of the 21st century.....

As far as the AK47 thing goes, Im surprised that someone who claims to be so well versed in the culture of our immigrant neighbors, you did not know that in a warlord governed country your social status is determined by the size of your gun and how many bullets you have.. In somalia an AK47 is more common than shoes...

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

like i said i.e. /\ /\ /\ /\

like i said i.e. /\ /\ /\ /\

seekingthetruth's picture

Yes, last fall I went shopping on Lisbon ST

I didnt find anything that I would buy. There was a little bit of hardware, but the price was twice the price of Walmart.

And I was treated like crap. It was obvious they hated me and didnt want me there.....until I did buy a couple fo small items, then they loved me.

Lisbon St is not an American friendly place at all.

Pirate's picture
verified

Should be called the "Little

Should be called the "Little Mogadishu Strip"

yeah right's picture

hey sun journal

let us knoiw where they got the money for this AND the money for college! I think sj just TRIES TO P&^S PEOPLE OFF!

WideStanceRepublican's picture

teh phuny

yer koment s r hilrios becs thy shw yer dpth of edgmacation. Moron.

thinkingman's picture

Wiki?

First the mayor in a column for Twin City Times and now the LSJ editorial board quote wiki? news to anyone over 25...Wiki is not a reliable source for any information and in fact anyone can post information as fact on that site without verification. If you're using wiki to make any point, you've already lost your argument.

Joseph's picture
verified

And what about Google?

I'm sure you Google all sorts of things in order to gain a little enlightenment no? That said, Wiki is merely a source for information — its reliability may be unverifiable in some cases but that's what their "citations" are for. But without question sourcing the internet is a valuable and increasingly viable way to get the information we all seek. Now just tell me you haven't used Wikipedia yourself to bolster an argument or two?

tron's picture

Wiki is much more reliable than

the Maine Heritage Policy Foundation, which appears to print your bible.

Pirate's picture
verified

I'll bet wiki is more

I'll bet wiki is more reliable than Faux News, too. And Jimmy Carter is not related to Alfred E. Neumann

thinkingman's picture

Gosh, heaven forbid the MPHC

Gosh, heaven forbid the MPHC uses facts, something you've grown allergic too on this blog...

tron's picture

MPHC makes up 'facts' that the sponsors

want them to. It has been proven over and over, like when they claimed we were the highest taxed state, when in reality we are in the middle of the pack!

thinkingman's picture

Actually they were proven to

Actually they were proven to be correct based on very narrow parameters, but thats the problem with statistics - for those who undertsand them anyway. But go ahead and bring up that old canard as you would say...

tron's picture

First, not only was MPHC wrong, it admitted its mistake, but

we could go back and forth all night, so tell me this, what do YOU alledge is incorrect about the facts of this editorial?

SonOfTron's picture

doesn't like source

now if i follow this, tron doesn't like mhpc as a source. he doesn't like someone using the ny post. this coming from someone who never provides sources and when asked refuses to provide any.

i guess we all should use the sites that he cites when asked to back his "facts".

BearBug's picture

Enough

Well I think it's all just more then enough. Somali this, Somlai that...blah blah blah. Yeah, give it up. We've had them shoved down out throats, and the SJ is only going going to print the "Fluff" stories. Heaven forbid the SJ insults them. It's okay for the SJ to put us down, and for preaves to take away our freedom of speach, because if it's a comment that SHE doesn't agree with...poof...it's gone! As I am sure this one won't make it out there for long. Yes, America is the melting pot of many cultures, I am Franco-American, and we have seen many nationalities and cultures come to Lewiston, but there is a difference today, then there has been in yester-year. We used to work together none the less, but today, it's not a matter of working together, it's a matter of remaining in their own outer circle, and and an attempt at taking over. If we were to go to their country, or another country to live, we would be expected to live by their means, ways, and cultures...as it should be here. But anyway, these are my thoughts and feelings, and before preaves makes them "poof" hopefully they will be seen. But it is also the last time I am going to comment on this subject, since because most of my feelings are fairly negative, my freedom of speech will once again be violated if I say the "wrong" thing.

Gregg's picture

Lisbon St

I have no problem with immigrants who arrive legally, adopt the U.S. as their country, pledge loyalty to the U.S., WORK, pay taxes, learn our language and become law abiding citizens. I do have a major problem with those who arrive illegally, immediately go on public assistance, make crime their source of income, hate the United States, yet demand special rights and come merely to plunder the social services we, more than generously, provide.

queenhoneeybee's picture
verified

and that is just that. you

and that is just that. you don't know... no one knows. they just assume. :(

Gary52's picture
verified

thinkingman, I can assure you

thinkingman, I can assure you that I know enough about Somali culture to realize that when they stack up in front of the neighborhood bank ATMs on the first of the month it's NOT because they all have direct PAYROLL deposits and employers who pay monthly. I had an office on Lisbon and Chestnut Streets for 22 years until mid-2009. I could go on, but I won't.

thinkingman's picture

I was not aware there were

I was not aware there were ATM's at that particular location....learn something new everyday....but tell me how you knew they were Somalian? they could just have easily been Bantu, Sengalese, Kenyan, etc...

skippy's picture

The Somalian communuiuty

The Somalian communuiuty could help itself assimilate by not dressing in such a way as they do, esp. the women. Just the way they stand out refusing to accept the norms of this Nation's dress code make them look as if they do not accept us; it's "in your face" type of behavior. I don't mind their using their language among themselves, but when working in serving the public they have to make a greater effort to learn English. While we should accept them as newcomers, they also have to accept the ways of the country that THEY chose to come to. They cannot expect to make America into another Somalia as they chose to leave their home turf for better.

WideStanceRepublican's picture

Idiot

By this logic we should all be living in teepees and wearing mukluks since we invaded the lands of Native Americans. None of the Somalis want to make this place Somalia, which suffers from civil conflict and extremely limited opportunity. We should welcome anyone and everyone who chooses to call this place home.

Woody's picture
verified

Thanks from the Francos

It's nice you allow the Somalis to speak their own language. May I assume your liberal views also allow the Francos to speak French?

tron's picture

Are white sheets part

of the dress code?

Pirate's picture
verified

Yeah, rubber ones for you bed

Yeah, rubber ones for you bed wetters.

preaves's picture
staff

Lets keep the conversation

Lets keep the conversation civil, guys.

RedWhiteBlue's picture

Don't you think that is a

Don't you think that is a little too much to ask of Liberals and Foreigners?

thinkingman's picture

When is the last time you saw

When is the last time you saw someone in lewiston or Auburn wearing a white sheet? what a stupid comment by a little man with nothing relvant to say...

tron's picture

the last time YOU

went out with the 'boys'

SonOfTron's picture

why?

why are statement like this from tron implying someone is a member of the kkk allowed to stay. doesn't this violate the policy?

toga toga

I 'd feel the same...even if it were 5000...white people suddenly moved in from another country

thinkingman's picture

Oh so you saw me in a white

Oh so you saw me in a white sheet? clearly you have nothing relevant to say so you're just making up stuff....and you barely get a slap on the wrist from Patty for basically accusing me and my "boys' of being clan members? So much for the rules not allowing racial issues...

veritas's picture
verified

This 'Nation' has a dress code???

I'll have to consult with Lady Gaga concerning that......

Pirate's picture
verified

It's called dressed up

It's called dressed up casual. Mandatory, is the flat billed ball cap, cocked 45 degrees to the left or right, depending on one's political persuasion.

gary52's picture

Tomorrow being the first of

Tomorrow being the first of the month, this area of Lisbon Street, along with area bank ATMs, will be very busy.

WideStanceRepublican's picture

Yep

Primarily with white folks who are on welfare.

Pirate's picture
verified

The Pirate and Widestance

The Pirate and Widestance haven't agreed on much lately, but there is common ground here, today.

thinkingman's picture

Gary, you might want to learn

Gary, you might want to learn about the Somalian and Muslim cultures view on fees and interest in regards to savings institutions before you make such comments. They do a better job than American ways.

SelfEmployed's picture

Somali's good, white man bad!

Somali's good, white man bad!

seekingthetruth's picture

None of the Somali stores on Lisbon st

sell anything that I buy....so what difference does it make to the average American?

Pericles's picture

What difference does your

What difference does your shopping habits make to the average American?

seekingthetruth's picture

You twist what I say around but it doesn't make you right

I never said the average American cares about my shopping habits.

I said that Lisbon St doesn't offer products for the average American

Big difference Einstein

ronh66's picture
verified

The paper should change it's name

Sun Journal should be re-named to the Somali Journal....Why are they tryin to force these people and their lifestyle on us....No matter how many fluff stories you print the fact remains there are alot of people who are not goin to welcome these people with open arms...The Sun Journal blots facts about how many are working ,they only print fluff stories like this one...They didn't even mention the gang busts of last week( the true somali bloods)....Why is that???Portland Press Hearld covered it,News 13 covered it....If the Sun Journal did cover they made sure they hid it deep in the paper....I am sure this post will get its negative feedback but I am just as intileted to my veiw as anyone else.....

WideStanceRepublican's picture

THANKS!!!

[This comment has been removed by the administrator]

preaves's picture
staff

This comment was removed for

This comment was removed for violating our commenting policy. We may not all agree, but please express your ideas respectfully.

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