Wind power has corrupted Maine

According to Scotsman Struan Stevenson, a member of the European Parliament, "wind turbines violate the principle of fairness by transferring vast amounts of money from poor to rich. They despoil our unique landscape and environment and through noise, the flicker effect and vibration, they abuse the health and welfare of people and animals that have to live near them."

Money has corrupted our legislators, be they Democrats — with former Gov. John Baldacci who initiated the process by executive order (where was the emergency?) — and now a Republican administration that stands idly by to let this scam go on. The Maine Public Utilities Commission and the Natural Resources Council of Maine have encouraged this scam.

I cannot find anyone representing the state willing to participate in a live radio or TV public debate about the merits, or lack thereof, relating to wind power.

How about it, Angus King? Rob Gardner? Dan Voorhees? Stacey Fitts?

Any one of them or all of them at once. It doesn't matter.

The truth is greater than them all.

Albert Aniel, Mexico

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Comments

Alice Barnett's picture

debate

come on WIND...I want to attend a debate.....Rumford would be a good place because First Wind wants that area for multiple wind farms.
Neil Keilly? Jeremy Payne? Ken Fletcher? Stacy Fitts? someone??

Mike DiCenso's picture

wind folly

Great letter , Dr. Aniel. They will not take you up on your offer. They will not supply any info to support their wild claims after repeated requests, either. A summer resident of Lincoln, Prof. Mahar of USF, offered to do a complete economic assessment on the Bowers project as he has done for the World Bank for 25 years,for free. Interestingly, LURC has not taken him up on his generous offer. It seems too many are willing to accept the wildly proposterous claims of the wind industry without demanding proof. Maybe that is a statement of our culture, accept the easiest and quickest answer and never question the developers , especially when they have dozens of lawyers on the payroll. Anyone who looks beyond the superficial fluff realizes that wind power has tremendous impacts on the environment. Roads never belong on the tops of mtns. The effects on those living nearby wind turbines is well documented but still ignored by the state agencies whose job it is to protect Maine citizens. The critics who claim "every little bit helps" are wrong. The miniscule contribution of wind power is buried under plumes of soot and C02 as more coal fired plants fire up in China. The US is shipping coal to China to build the turbines and process the rare earth metals. Wind power is neither clean nor green.

Steve  Dosh's picture

Wind power has corrupted Maine

Al ,. .Wind power has not corrupted Maine ( maybe Mexico and TX :) http://bangordailynews.com/2011/09/02/opinion/contributors/blustering-rh... <- not an endorsement
b t w - Happy 11.09.12 e v e r y o n e . Stop the sense less , waste ful , and noisey National Guard ƒ-16 fly overs :)

Jason Theriault's picture

Wind will be much more competative

Here is my thinking, and if someone can point out where I'm wrong, feel free:

1. Wind is not getting more expensive, where as oil and other fuel based power generation are.

2. It will only get cheaper when economies of scale come into play

3. If we use this opportunity to became a major player in wind power(like how UMO is working on it) we could take a leadership position, and reap a high paying technical industry.

MARK GRAVEL's picture

FYI: Oil is not used widely to generate electricity.

Dear Jason:
1. Oil is not used in any significant quantity to generate electrical power. Coal and natural gas are the predominant fossil fuels used to generate electricity. Moreover, “Fracking” has improved natural gas yield and driven down gas prices.

2. China controls 96% of the rare earth elements used to create the powerful magnets used to manufacture wind generators. OPEC is to oil like China is to rare earth elements.

3. For the reason cited in 2 the US is unlikely to be a leader in wind turbine manufacturing. Currently most wind turbine equipment is manufactured in China. Moreover, wind energy is only a supplemental electrical source. There still needs to be enough spot energy production to satisfy peak power demands when the wind does not blow or blows lightly.
In closing, having to support parallel infrastructures for both fossil and wind will drive up cost to all consumers. I’m not saying wind does not have any attributes, but it is by far a panacea.

Cheers,
Mark Gravel

Jason Theriault's picture

Gary, nice wall of text

Hey, should I post a long article from Greenpeace? Would that be convincing? BTW- You migtht have just violated the DMCA.

Post a link next time.

Mike Miles's picture

So you love oil, eh?

It is broadly acknowledged that we are in a time of peak oil. That is to say, we have located most of the earth's oil, and we are sucking it dry. We have seen oil costs double in the past few years, and it is gonna double again in the next few years.

80% of maine's transportation and heating comes from oil. There is a world of hurt around the corner for all of us. Folks who oppose wind energy enjoy the pretense that energy supplies are inexhaustible, and are willing to bet their children's futures on it. I am not. In the same way that I hate the reality that we are putting 40% of the US budget on a creddit card for our children to pay. Let's act like mature adults, folks, and start paying our own way, and stop saying no to projects like wind power that can help us to avoid worsening our national economic nightmare.

Wind and solar won't solve the energy problem. No one claims they can.

But they, in combination with other strategies like conservation, can mitigate the impact. Like any technology in its infancy, it currently requires subsidy. It won't get to maturity without investment and public support. The economic arguments against wind power disappear when you take into account the inexorable increase in the cost of fossil fuel energy, which have to increase as supply diminishes.

Further, arguments against the economic viability about wind power fly in the face of the reality that folks who are funding it think otherwise, and they are the ones who are putting down the cash to make it work.

From where I sit, most of the real objection to wind power is nimbyism. We don't want it in our back yard.

We don't want it for aesthetic reasons, and we don't want it because there is wild scaremongering that suggests something evil is going on, that someone out there is making money on this (as if that is a bad thing),and that there are health effects that are not avoidable. And at some level, there is opposition based on the feeling that saying "no" makes powerful.

I personally have no objection to the aesthetics of a windmill or wind farm. And there is one proposed for my back yard. From an ecological perspective, and from a practical, resource based planning perspective, it makes sense to support wind power in places wheere it is viable, and where it won't otehrwise impact peoples lives.

There is an active plan, right now, to build wind farms off the coast of Maine that could generate as much as half of the state's energy needs in 20 years. Cianbro and BIW are currently, right now, building the turbines and blades for a pilot project(there are thousands of jobs here). The learning that we get as this project moves up to scale over the next couple of decades will help us to learn year after year how to both do this better, and also how to wean ourselves off unhealthy reliance on fossil fuels.

Alice Barnett's picture

windfall

you personally like wind turbines....do you own land near a wind farm? How much is your land valued now?

Here is a list of 305 property owners (with-in 2 miles from a proposed project) in Dixfield Maine that will hear 3-5 times more noise than they are used to. Their property values will go down. Ask the Whittermores why their home did not sell.

abbott
abbott
abbott
adams
adams
albrecht
alpaugh
arrow
arsenault
awalt
babbitt
bates
baumgartel
bean
beedy
beggs
bellegarde
Belskis
bernard
berry
berry
berry
berry
blanchard
blouin
bolduc
blouin
bourgoin
bradeen
brann
brann
brann
brann
brown
brown
brown
brown
brundage
buotte
burgess
burgess
burns
brann
cannon
carlton
carlton
bryant
bryant
bucci
buchanan
carter
chase
child
collins
collins
cook
coolidge
coolidge
coolide
coolidge
crane
crocker
daigneault
cumberland security corp
curit
curtis
curtis
curtis
daley
daley
dolloff
elliott
dustin
dyer
dzuz
e & l logging
durrell
drottar
drown
dunham
daley
daley
ellis
ellis
ellis
ellis
enman
eno
farwell
felt
finnan
fitch
fletcher
fletcher
frank
fuchs
gagnon
gallant
gammon
garbarini
gilsleider
given
gladu
glover
goldthwaite
goodwin
gould
graham
grant
gray
grignon
gullage
gurney
haley
haley
hall
hall
haney
hanmer
hardy
harkness
harvell
harvey
harvey
haylock
haynes
haynes
hebert
hebert
hebert
hebert
heintz
heintz
hill
hiscock
hixon
hodge
hodge
hodgson
hodsdon
holcomb
holman
holman
holman
holman
horne
houghton
hutchins
hutchinson
jalbert
jarvis
jasud
jewett
jordan
jordan
kersey
kersey
kersey
knight
knowles
knowles
labbe
labrecque
landry
lane
laplant
laprell
larsen
latouche
le ray
legere
libby
lindstedt
linnekin
littlehale
macfarland
macomber
marcoux
marshall
marston
martell
mcpherson
mawhinney
mckeen
menthe
merrill
merrill
merrill
merrill
merrill
met life home loans
michaud
mills
mcvay
medcoff
melvin
menthe
moody
moody
morin
morin
morrison
minardi
montgomery
morrison motors
morrison
morse
murphy
newbold
noyes
noyes
nye
oakes
packard
palmer
palmer
parise
pelletier
pendexter
pepin
perkins
perry
philbrick
phillips
pierce
pineau
piper
porter
pratt
pratt
quinn
rackliffe
ranger
recktenwald
rene
rice
richard
richards
ridley
rodrigues
rollins
rollins
rollins
rovers inc
roy
rumley
sampson
servants of jesus christ
shardlow
smith
sprague
s-severy lodge corp
stearns
smith
smith
steeves
stefani
stefani
sterns
stowe
soubble
speranza
sprague
swan
swan
swan
thebarge
theriault
thorndike & sons
thurston
tifft
tompkins
towle
ownsend
trifilo
dixfield common baptist church
turner
twitchell
tyler
underwood
volkernick
waite
waite
wang
webb river sportsman club
webster
weeks
welch
welch
werner
white
white
white
whitman
whitman
whittermore
whittermore
whittington
windover
witas
wolos
wright
wright
wright

Mike Miles's picture

In fact I do own land near a proposed wind farm

And yes, I do like the idea of wind power, so long as it is located in places where people are not hurt by them. By hurt, I mean, it cannot be noisy. It might make the scenic vista different, but in my book that does not count as hurt. We have oil, or we have alternatives. You cannot say no to all of the alternatives without keeping us in preposterously perilous circumstances relying on oil. Printing a long list of names means nothing, nor does a rhetorical question asserting that someobody nobody knows has their property value impacted by a proposed development.

Alice Barnett's picture

okay do not hurt

300+ wetlands destroyed on one project hurts animals and humans. Drilling and blasting water tables on top of mountains causes flooding down land... Please, the destruction of water, habitats and plant life should be enough hurt.
Those people on that list are real and they will be hurt by erosion, noise and property values.
GRID scale WIND is a scam that rich companies can use to get your tax dollar.

Do you like paying for ethanol even though you know it is hurting the environment?

Mike Miles's picture

In fact I do own land near a proposed wind farm

And yes, I do like the idea of wind power, so long as it is located in places where people are not hurt by them. By hurt, I mean, it cannot be noisy. It might make the scenic vista different, but in my book that does not count as hurt. We have oil, or we have alternatives. You cannot say no to all of the alternatives without keeping us in preposterously perilous circumstances relying on oil. Printing a long list of names means nothing, nor does a rhetorical question asserting that someobody nobody knows has their property value impacted by a proposed development.

Jason Theriault's picture

Geeze

First off, its there some sort of bet or something to make this the longest forum conversation of somthing in terms of lines used? There is no need for this crap.

Also, your logic is crap. Yeah, I bet the housing crisis had NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS. The reason their home values dropped was purely the windmills, not THE COLLAPSE OF THE US HOUSING MARKET.

This is like blaming going blind on watching television when someone throws acid in your face.

Alice Barnett's picture

nope

nope the buyer was all for the beautiful property over looking Colonel Holman Mountain. When the buyer became aware a project is proposed they walked..no sale...

Those names are people that have paid taxes for generations on their property...they do not want to be sold out by tax sucking projects such as grid scale wind...stop this over use of our taxes. Wind is old technology...it does not foot the bill...

geo thermal is answer in Costa Rica, Nevada...
Hydro is the answer in Maine and New England..

Wind Turbines will fail...
and towns will go bankrupt

Jason Theriault's picture

So one example = fact

Ok, so one dude walked.

Hydro isn't the answer because
1.Most good rivers already are damned
2. Just like wind, people find a reason to complain.

We should just build a couple of Nuclear reactors and move the Yuma Nuclear waste repository site to Maine. People want to complain regardless of what you do, so why bother trying to make em happy.

Alice Barnett's picture

small scale hydro

along the same lines as tidal...that damn in Rumford could have several series of smaller dams in front of it. smaller dams such as the tidal generators. if water gets low, turn them off or pull them up.

i know people will complain but GRID scale WIND is using your children's tax dollar to ruin your mountain tops for expensive erractic wind. WIND will bankrupt your town based on property value loss alone.

Gary Steinberg's picture

Don't Bitch Maine Businessesd as Your Electric Costs Soar!

Maine Business is Being SCREWED by Wind!

Never mind that in 2010, oil and natural gas provided nearly 200 times as much energy to the U.S. economy as all solar and wind energy production combined. Never mind that the Energy Information Administration recently estimated that wind-generated electricity costs about 50% more than that produced by natural gas-fired generators while solar-generated electricity costs at least 200% more.

Bob Woodbury's picture

Never mind...

...oil and natural gas will be as common as dinosaurs sooner than we realize. Then what would you suggest?

Alice Barnett's picture

forever

solar, wood, hydro methane

Bob Woodbury's picture

From what I understand...

...solar has the same complaints and drawbacks as wind; wood will decimate our forests, which includes mountains and not just on top; I've heard of methane coming from cows but not from water, so you've got me there.

Gary Steinberg's picture

The Farce called Wind Power Blows from the Top

[Comment removed by the administrator]

Dr. Aniel got it right

Rumford has had two votes on wind power in their town. The third one is coming up and what happens in such a timely fashion? It seems the paper mill is in the process of chpter 11 due to finances. What people don't understand is that it is the companies that control the harvested wood that has cut off the supply of wood to the mill. These same logging companies are connected to the financial backing of the wind turbine projects. By cutting lumber, selling lumber, owning the property that the wind turbines are being placed and leasing the logging land around the turbine projects, there is a lot of money to be made. Sorry folks, but the people that you thought would protect the forests are the ones investing in wind turbines and sucking the tax payer of money that the government doesn't have... When is some one going to say NO to the fleecing of the government and the unstablization of the economic system of Maine????

Karen  Pease's picture

Thank you.

Thank you, Dr. Aniel, for this letter.

There isn't much chance any of the wind lobby or its supporters will take you up on your offer of a debate, though. We've seen, time and time again, that when they come up against people armed with scientific and economic facts rather than rhetoric, they have no defense. All one needs to say to them is "Prove it!" when they make their sales pitches... and watch them stumble and stammer and change the topic.

No, the good people of Maine will have to do independent research on the topic of indstrial wind. We need to be proactive, instead of swallowing the line the corporate wind industry has been feeding us to gain our support. Once they know the facts, they see this folly for what it is. Only then will they stand up, step forward, and demand an accounting.

Thank you for your courage, integrity and tenacity.

Respectfully,
Karen Pease
Lexington Twp., Maine

Penny Gray's picture

A recent poll in the BDN

A recent poll in the BDN indicated that over 80% of Maine residents would not want an industrial wind installation in their town. Although the media and corportate politicians have mostly promoted the wind developers agenda, Mainers are doing their homework. The information is out there. Industrial wind is not green, it doesn't provide the promised hundreds of local jobs, nor does it lower CO2, shut down existing power plants or provide enough power to offset the environmental sacrifices we're being asked (ordered) to make. Maine is one of the most beautiful states in the nation and tourism it its biggest economic engine. Industrial wind doesn't belong here. Period.

Rob Pforzheimer's picture

Wind power has corrupted VT, NY, MA, etc. as well as ME

Building inefficient, environmentally destructive generation that we don't even need in the name of creating jobs or saving the world from global warming is ludicrous.
It would be preferable to pay people to dig holes and others to fill them in rather than pay subsidy sucking parasite wind developers to destroy our mountains, wildlife and human habitat.
Where are the benefits for anyone but the developers, leaseholders, and their hedge fund and foreign investors?
Anyone reponding that industrial wind will cut emissions, please provide examples.
These monstosities will soon be rusting. oil leaking monuments to stupidity, gullibility, corruption, and greed.
Use Less

Jason Theriault's picture

"I cannot find anyone

"I cannot find anyone representing the state willing to participate in a live radio or TV public debate about the merits, or lack thereof, relating to wind power."

Hmmm....I was going to be mean, but I decided to take a more reasonable tack. It's called confirmational bias. We tend to give credit and take more seriously arguments that fit into our perspective.

The reason you haven't found anyone is that the studies you hold as fact are weak and based on bad science. You're looking for a reason to oppose wind mills because you don't want them, regardless of benefits.

Alice Barnett's picture

benefits

give me some benefits and I can show where you are wrong.

WIND = 75% it does not blow, 10-30% loss in transmission, 5% "parasitic" draw from the GRID.

WIND sucks stimulis money from Americans and gives it to foreign countries.

Jason Theriault's picture

Well...

15% to 35% losses from transmission and parasitic draw apply to all electrical power generation.

Secondly, the whole 75% it does not blow is just made up or really not relevant. Really, it comes down to cost per kilowatt, and Wind is cost effective if in the right place. Can it replace on demand sources like Coal, oil, Gas and Nuclear? No.

Can it be sued to lessen our demand for them? Yes.

Alice Barnett's picture

costs per kilowatt

75% wind does not blow is irrelevant?
costs per kilowatt? try the tune of 3-4 million dollars a turbine and figure out how many kilowatts will make a break even point. By the time you do that the turbines need repairs..
I guess bats and birds and bees and animal habitats are not costly.
Jason, this wind energy is a scam and will not save the earth.
Our demand for electricity will grow and grow and there is not enough room on earth for all the wind facilities needed.

$500 will buy you 1 kilowatt of solar panels.....place on site and there is no transmission loss.
Added benny...you are not totally dependent on the GRID.

Jason Theriault's picture

Thats the thing

The cost per kilowatt is hard to estimate because turbines are breakdown prone. However, from a quick search, I have found that the costs of windpower are not significantly higher than other green sources(hydro being the cheapest)

That said, I love how you complain about the wind not always blowing, then you segue right into solar, where there is never a cloudy day and that everyone has a good view of the southern sky. And where did you find a $500 1kw kit? From What I've seen, most kits were in the $3,000-5,000 range.

Your cost per kilowatt of Solar in Maine is not advantageous.

Alice Barnett's picture

$500 kilowatt

It is not funny but, a subcontractor can buy unframed solar panels from Miami Florida warehouse because Korea did not accept a delivery from USA.
My price is not a kit. panels only. comparing because a turbine is a turbine, it needs transmission lines to work.

I have lived off the grid for 10 years. While the sun may shine 50% of the time I bought extra panels to ensure my batteries are topped off.
I still use propane for refrigeration, maybe next year I buy more solar and batteries and run frig.

My solar panels are not affecting you in the least, where as 12 # 460 foot turbines on a ridge affects any one with-in 8 miles. If you bought land in Rangeley, do not let go of it. It is in protected area and will be worth a fortune in the next 5 years.

Please consider the alternatives in Maine...hydro...wood....solar...on site generation for homes.

Help us stop big wind.

Jason Theriault's picture

Ugh

Ok, the solar panels your guy can buy cause SK backed out is more of a solution for you, and a bunch of people. Not for an comemrcial development.

Secondly, The amount the turbines affect you is disputed. From what I've read, It seems to be people looking to be annoyed by them are annoyed by them.

Third, Big wind? Seriously? Big Oil...Yes. Big Government... sure. Big Wind? Noooo... Maybe once they are in the trillion dollar range in revenues.

Bob Woodbury's picture

Please...

...where did you get your stats?

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