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Church teachings are clear

Christopher Rioux
Letters |
Tuesday, October 27, 2009

In Pamella Beliveau's column (Oct. 18), "A committed marriage is a worthy aspiration," she says: "We must protect our children from people spreading questionable, fearful and outright hurtful rhetoric about gays and lesbians who live, work and love in our state."

Did she just admit that she agrees with the gay activists — that children should be taught acceptance of the homosexual lifestyle regardless of the desires and beliefs of their parents?

For a supposedly educated Catholic, she apparently knows nothing about the Catholic Church's teachings on marriage, sexuality, or the inalienable rights of children to both a mother and a father. None of the church's teachings on these issues have anything to do with spreading "fear" or "hurtful rhetoric." The church teaches, carefully and clearly, that the state has no authority to change the definition of marriage; that giving such legal status to homosexual unions is a grave injustice to society; and, therefore, it is a grave sin for Catholics to support same-sex "marriage."

I am getting a little tired of all these make-believe "practicing" Catholics. Anyone who refuses to believe what the church teaches on faith or morals puts themselves out of the church.

Beliveau should practice what she preaches. She should stop impugning "hate" and "fear" in the name of "love," and she should have the honesty to attend a church that reflects her beliefs.

Christopher Rioux, Lewiston

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Displaying comments, from newest to oldest

anokhi's picture

The comment I just posted

By anokhi, unverified — Mon, 11/02/2009 - 15:55

The comment I just posted was in response to an article of Oct. 31st where the majority of comments were in derision of the Church, the Priest and the Teaching of the Church on marriage. I was unable to submit it...so I copied it and pasted it to this commentary.
The sentence I am referring to is: "What I find most astounding concerning the theme of most of these posts is how the individuals submitting the posts are experts on the mind of God and Jesus. "
I was responding to the denigrating nature of the comments of supporters of Gay Marriage of that article of 2 days ago and not to the comments of this present forum which is much more supportive of one of the basic tenets of the RCC.
I viewed an article today where managers of the support gay marriage are e-mailing people in New Hampshire and the Boston area to come to Maine to just be in the streets and show support for gay marriage because they saw a poll where they are 4 points behind now. They are putting them up for free in some motel in So. Portland. I imagine their campaign will foot the bill.

anokhi's picture

Where is the hatred being

By anokhi, unverified — Mon, 11/02/2009 - 15:36

Where is the hatred being exercised on the part of the Priest? A Catholic who holds a prominent and influential position in the Church in public, open defiance of a teaching of the Catholic church is a serious matter. If a person joined the Knights of Columbus or the Masons and then picketed outside these establishments that they disagreed with the policies of the organizations...how absurd would that be?

I have no idea who the sources are who are calling this a scandal. Ms. Beliveau wasn't removed from the church. She was removed from the lector/EM ministry......perhaps it will be a temporary exemption....after her being in the middle of the limelight dies down.

What I find most astounding concerning the theme of most of these posts is how the individuals submitting the posts are experts on the mind of God and Jesus. It is true that Jesus hung around with some very unsavory characters, but He didn't condone their sinful ways. He actually warned them what the wages of sin entails. He told the adulteress that he saved to "Go and sin no more". The only real pronouncement Jesus made on human sexuality concerns the union of male and female as the expression of the order created by God (with an explicit quotation from Genesis 1:27 and 2:24) in a discussion on marriage: "Have you not read that He who made them from the beginning made them male and female ... and the two shall become one?" (Mt 19:4-5; Mk 10:6-7).

St.Paul had more to say about it in Romans 1: 26-27. He actually expounds on the sexual practices of men with men and women with women. It seems he didn't have to go into the topic of performing marriages for homosexuals.

So evidently, a percentage of Catholics would attribute St. Paul's position on Gays and Lesbians to the rantings of a befuddled old man and the rantings of an old and misguided stick-in-the-mud.

Thom Cote's picture

Thank you Christopher for

By Thom Cote, unverified — Wed, 10/28/2009 - 10:22

Thank you Christopher for saying what so many faithful Catholics believe. Catholics need to wake up and realize that they are being used by those who want gay marriage. They are being mislead by those that call themselves Catholic and do not follow Church teachings. The Maine Civil Liberties Union is in the business of misleading the faithful and they go so far as to give out "Catholics for Marriage Equality" buttons and bumper stickers at debates, etc. And triumph doesn't know what he is talking about. You didn't excommunicate millions of the faithful. As Catholics we have a duty to admonish the sinner by stating that those that sin and go against Church teaching are in fact separating themselves from their faith. Those that do not follow Church teaching and remain in the Catholic church are hoping to change the church from within. It won't happen! Vote Yes on 1 and keep marriage as one man and one woman.

nikita80's picture

And please don't throw back

By nikita80, unverified — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 09:19

And please don't throw back the history of how people were living during various eras in the Bible or rules given spicifically to the Jews, and try to pass them off as laws for the Christians.

bellegarde24's picture

Why not? I mean I've seen

By bellegarde24, unverified — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 09:59

Why not? I mean I've seen them used at least half a dozen times here on this website by Christians attacking homosexuals with these cherry picked passages of old testament. So tell me Why is it only when we use the self same section of the bible, the one you've been beating us over the head, and toss out a few choice passages to make you look foolish. Why only then is it out of bounds?

And why must we follow your churches practices on this. there are a number of different faiths in this country and state. Some of them have quite differing views on marriage and homosexuality?

verified

Let us see how well we are

By Joseph Ziehm, verified user — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:14

Let us see how well we are doing in keeping God and his commandments pure and clean within the United States; Leviticus 18: 22 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind it is abomination." Or as with Jude 17-19 "But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ: How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. Thee be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit." We as Christians have had the danger markers in society and seeing what will bring about the end times and we continually ignore it. All the while it seems that the growing tide of militant energy is slowly wearing away at the very seems of Christianity. Again I have noticed several of those who vouch the Golden Rule Matthew 22: 39 "And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." And, again in Matthew 19: 4-6 "And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, for this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore GOD hath joined together, let not man put asunder." And, Matthew 5: 17-18 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

This is from the KJV and it sickens me as a Baptist that so many fall away from GOD simply to fulfill their own passions, lusts, and desires. Is it correct then to have those emotions as a Christian toward the homosexual community and the newly formed gay agenda? Yes, that is what the scripture teaches and what many seek to avoid and look at how many civilizations have fallen into disarray? We have simply fallen into no longer believing what more can be said other then that true Christianity may have failed yet there are still Christians who believe in the word of GOD and see through the overpowering dimensions of those who mislead the public and probe to destroy what has been printed. We do not seek to destroy as this was posted in a previous topic we seek to save and as you stated a number of different faiths why switch the topics to different faiths? Can you refute what has been posted here on continually cry foul ball about the scripture being used against you. Please, no alterations the KJV is the only complete Bible written fairly.

Joseph Ziehm
Lewiston, ME
"Masters, give unto your servants that which is just and equal; knowing that ye also have a master in heaven. Continue in prayer, and watch in the same with thanksgiving;" Colossians 4: 1-2

bellegarde24's picture

I/m not here to cry foul do

By bellegarde24, unverified — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:30

I/m not here to cry foul do to the fact that the bible has been used as a cudgel against homosexuals like it has in the bast agaisnt blacks and jews. I'm here to cry foul against the hypocrisy of folks like you. See you've committed the same sin Jami warned us away from particularly the "Rules given spicifically to the Jews, and try to pass them off as laws for the Christians" You've done that in your quote of Leviticus here but if I was to go on and quote Leviticus as to the eating of rabbits or shellfish, which are equally sinfull according to him I'd have been shouted down since that part of the bible is meant only for the Jewish faith. But I do know that there is no arguing with a religious zealot we'll shout and scream and in the end neither of us will have changed our minds we'll leave with nothing but a headache and sore throats. So have a good day

jchick's picture
verified

It's not that simple. Many

By John Chick, verified user — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 17:16

It's not that simple. Many of the laws that God gave the Jews through Moses where part of a covenant that He made with them. Specifically the ceremonial laws pertaining to worship, sacrifices, and the laws pertaining to sanctification (clean vs unclean). They were to be "set appart" as a people, holy unto the Lord.

But there are also other laws that pertain to government and morality that God expects all people to obey, Christian or not. They are written on our hearts (i.e. conscience)so that even people who have never heard about God or his laws are still without excuse. They can't say "I didn't know it was wrong to murder someone" or "I didn't know it was wrong to steal". In the Bible, homosexuality is a moral issue, as is adultery, incest and bestiality. God's judgement on Sodom and Gomorrah ocurred long before the events of Leviticus where he gave Israel the Law through Moses.

John A. Chick

"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be." -- Thomas Jefferson in a letter to Colonel Charles Yancey (January 6, 1816)

verified

Acts 10: 10-16 "And he

By Joseph Ziehm, verified user — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:43

Acts 10: 10-16 "And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance, And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth: Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, not so, Lord: for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, what God hath cleansed, that call not thou common. This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven." I have no rules or ground rule commons as Jami has commented their is a book called a Bible which is the plenary verbal inspiration of GOD good day.

Joseph Ziehm
Lewiston, ME
"Masters, give unto your servants that which is just and equal; knowing that ye also have a master in heaven. Continue in prayer, and watch in the same with thanksgiving;" Colossians 4: 1-2

triumph's picture

"Anyone who refuses to

By triumph, unverified — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 07:33

"Anyone who refuses to believe what the church teaches on faith or morals puts themselves out of the church. Did this writer just excommunicate millions of faithful? Whew! No "judgment" there, huh?

nikita80's picture

I don't think the writer

By nikita80, unverified — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 09:15

I don't think the writer excummunicated anyone. I think he gave his opinion. However, those who refuse to believe their churches teachings would not be considered " faithful". They would be considered "unfaithful" wouldn't they?

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